Kronos Naxxramas Release: disappointment

Hello Kronos.


First of all, as a veteran Kronos player who started here in day 1, long ago during that saturday afternoon in march 2015, I would like to say that I am and I will always be truly greatful for all the efforts you put into this project. We have the chance to play and have so much fun for free only because of you. Thank you very much for that.
With that being said, I feel like I need to share my feelings about this past weekend, and how the greatly announced Kronos Naxxramas release turned out to be.


If I had to choose only one word to describe the whole release would be "dissapointing". Don't get me wrong, competing for something I care about is always entertaining for me and I had lots of fun.
Then, why do I say that it was dissapointing? Well, mainly because Kronos is supposed to be a synonym of quality. You always put great effort into detail, and although you are not perfect and the server still has many many bugs, the overall quality of this project has always been really good compared to your competition.


So I ask myself: what the hell happened here? I mean, Naxxramas is the ultimate goal of the whole game. The most important instance. The AQ40 release may have had its problems, but for this you prepared for a long time, did PTR testing (unlike AQ) for all wings except the final one, you delayed its release for so many months, and for what? For:
1. Having bugs that were already reported and fixed in the PTR back on live: Patchwerk's Hateful Strike based on threat instead of health (Naxx is WotLK! xD), Anub'rekhan's Impale, among others.
2. Not fixing issues reported months ago during each corresponding PTR.
3. Not doing a proper testing for basic things, like zone in to the raid for example, or the annoying silverpine teleport.
4. The animations of some bosses' abilites absolutley screwed.
And I could keep on listing things, but I think I made my point. With all the time you took to prepare this release, if we are to compare to our competition who probably took half the time you did to prepare their release, I think you can make your own conclussions.


On the other hand, as many of you already know, Kronos had the KT bug fixes ready to be applied the very first night after Synced and Vanguard did many attempts to kill him. I wonder, why haven't you applied it already? Why didn't you apply it that very same night? Why are you waiting untill wednesday? Are those guild the only ones that matter here or what? Those kind of decisions increase even more my feelings of dissapointment.


This weekend left a bad taste, and a bad memory that I will probably never forget. I had high hopes for you.


Well not everything was bad, as I said I had lots of fun, and there are really good memories too that I will treasure.
Things I think you did right:
- Disabling world buffs (thank you very much for this!).
- Overtuning at least the last 2 bosses (it really felt like a real progression! If you would have not done that, the whole instance would have been a joke. Sorry but if you did overtune any other bosses, it was hardly noticeable).
- Having GMs almost 100% of the time helping people that got bugged or needed help with Naxx issues (teleported to Silverpine, etc).


I have no doubt that you will fix all Naxx problems eventually and it will turn to be a great quality raid in the end, but this release at least for me was extremely dissapointing.




Thanks for reading my text-wall to anyone that took the time for it.


See you in the battlefield.

tristan said:

On the other hand, as many of you already know, Kronos had the KT bug fixes ready to be applied the very first night after Synced and Vanguard did many attempts to kill him. I wonder, why haven't you applied it already?

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Only hitbox and abomination mortal wound. Look at the announcement they made today. With all the other bugs that are now fixed, do you think abomination fixes would have mattered at all? Seeing how both VG and Risen figured out very fast how to go through phase 1 successfully, it wouldn't have changed anything. The rest of the bugs were discovered yesterday after we submitted our bug reports to Chero after we called it a night after total of about 10 hours wiping to KT during the weekend.

It does not matter if there were or there were not more bugs found at that point. Anything that was found and actually already fixed should have been applied instantly, and the devs should have never consulted anyone about it. Period.

And I'm not discussing if it was killable or not, just pointing out the fact that they acted like the whole rest of the guilds didn't matter.

They should have left Anub in its original state. Made it challenging

GMs consult players on a daily basis about their issues. Guilds that were affected at the given time were consulted.
This is where "project" word comes into attention. Kronos is about everybody here, not about us.

In my opinion, the fairest approach is to delay the changes of unkilled bosses to next raid reset. Why?
It's simple. Guilds that were wiping on over-tuned encounters would complain why others had it easier.
Guilds that spent X hours at any encounter would complain why others did not have to.

Not every issue that appeared would be fixed at that night (in this part you are kinda misinformed), and the encounter would be still very, very hard.

It is not really easy to be right for everybody at the same time. Either due to raid schedule or due to something else.

I don't mind which guild will do it first, I'm not involved in any - just trying to stay as fair as possible. yet, due to raid resetting at 6 AM, NA guilds have more suitable time to raid than EU guilds. Am I biased? If so, why? Resetting instances on Wednesday at 6 AM is used since the beginning. I don't mind who will manage to log in and kill KT as first - let it be EU or NA guild. Anybody can if they wish to.

Of course every guild matters, and we care about players indeed. But the sad part of this is, that every guild is caring about their members only, which is completely understandable. However, decisions have to be made kinda globally, to have the fairest environment for each guild, or at least for the most.

i've been enjoying naxx alot and am very greatfull for the amount of work chero and his team has put into it.

the bugs is somthing that is expected even if some of those things were fixed on ptr and made some of us not over the top guilds in terms of preparation struggle a bit.. it was still very enjoyable

i'm very greatfull for what the kronos team has done and wish some people would see that instead of complaining about bugs or overtuning that didnt allow you to steamroll the entire raid in 1 day (look at topic about people complaining about not wanting to have naxx finished in 1 day) so it seems like some people are never happy

Chero, Naxx is great.

It's just a shame that:

1) Both of the last two bosses, the most important bosses in the whole Vanilla, had gamebreaking bugs (I would call KT ones "gamebreaking overtuning", but it doesn't change much).

2) Some - rather minor in my opinion - issues that were also quick to fix (talking Anub and Patchwerk - are those who claim "most of the bosses were bugged" have other examples?) made their way to release.

3) As for when to fix KT and who to ask, you wouldn't please everyone anyway.

If things will be fixed quick, Kronos still a synonim of quality, in my opinion. Regular players didn't see the last two bosses in their most bugged state anyway.

P.S. Kudos to Risen for being the best among non-crazy, gratz to Vanguard for Sapph FK.

Chero, I think you are missing the main point of this thread.


It is not argue about the guild competition drama (which at this point considering how things turned out doesn't really matter anyways), but rather point out that this was probably the lowest quality event that the server had since the existance of this version of Kronos, the international one.
You let bugs already tested and fixed in PTRs, and some others reported pretty much in the first PTR wings like almost a year ago, to somehow make it to live and at least for me as a developer myself and considering the many many months you delayed this release, is unforgivable for the ultimate raid in the game.
As you already know, another project did a similar or even probably better Naxx release recently with half the time of preparation. I will always be thankful to this project, but you kinda broke my heart with how you handled this release.


But let's move on, I know you will fix everything eventually because you have great skills to do so. You have proven that in all the years this project has existed.




P.S.: As for the guild drama, the problem I have with the decisions you made is not if you consult about bugs and such with guilds, that's perfectly fine because it is your main resource of information for fixing bugs, and at least my guild is always happy to help providing information to fix bugs.
The problem is that you cannot base YOUR DECISION AS THE STAFF regarding when to apply fixes, in what guilds think you should do that may affect their "competition". It is silly to decide to hold your fixes, whatever bugs they were to fix (only 1 bug, or every bug in a boss), just because 2 guilds wanted to finish their race to decide who has the biggest penis.
Doing that is what makes you look like you don't care about the rest of the guilds in the server.

The AQ40 release may have had its problems

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Understatement of the century. Compared to AQ, Naxx release will go down as the Gold Standard of content releases within the private server community.

just because 2 guilds wanted to finish their race to decide who has the biggest penis.

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We wanted KT to be fixed that night. I guess there was no consensus to be found.