Backporting features from newer versions

[hbee]

I hope title did not cause any brain hemorrhage for the most dedicated Classic purists...

I would like to raise some discussion about the features found in newer versions while we are waiting for the server to go online. I suppose one could raise a point that the Classic experience would be ruined by the most minute changes but in my opinion, some flexibility could be in order if this would make the server more popular.

The proper implementation would (to my knowledge) require the additional APIs not found in Classic... I have no deeper knowledge of the back-end used in these projects so maybe the developers have slightly better ideas how these could be implemented. Maybe some dedicated chat channel and a custom addon (could the look even be ripped from the retail version where this feature is already found?) could be used?

1) LFG. Not the version where the group is teleported to the instance, obviously, but one where players could announce the desired instance and role and join a common queue instead of desperately spamming Trade or World channels for a group.

2) Achievements. I would argue achievements would increase the activity of the players greatly (and thus drive more players to the World instead of jumping on the IF mailbox or on the roof of OGs bank). What I can remember from the retail, people were doing the most boring and useless tasks to gain the additional 10 achievement points .

Some other things that are lingering in my mind:
-friend lists using account ID instead of character name?
-some kind of Armory implementation?
-timed instances (for competitiveness)?

What are your thoughts on these kind of suggestions?



Also some bonus questions I've been wondering (on the technical level) what are our changes in modifying the game client?
-could we for example somehow use the new character models from MoP (I believe) in Classic client?
-could the game world be modified (for example to use the original AV)?
-or would it be possible to use TBC/WOTLK/whatever client only for Classic content? This would provide the additional APIs but would there be any potential upsides? The GUI would be messed as there would be newer content but could this be fixed with some LUA scripting or something if one would be determined?

 

[Hogger]

1. I personally like the Vanilla method of putting together groups. As long as the server has a healthy population.

2. I don't have anything against achievements. But to me, it's a whole lot of fluff that I don't care about.

 

[goris]

...

@LFG..Something like that works after talking to the inkeeper
@Achievements..imho too difficult if not impossible. Also there's not enough game content to make many achievements
@Friendlist..a nice idea, don't know if realistic though. Also, some say(hope?) that there will not be many alts because of 1* xprates
@Armory..all other twinstar realms have it and it is planned for Kronos aswell. Not gonna be ready for launch, but we were told we can expect it somewhere along they way.
@timed instances.. i believe there was something of this kind on the TBC realm. not sure though

 

[Lharts]

1) This was a feature on the previous version of Chronos. People could Q into an instance at any Innkeeper and were put into a group automatically once enought players signe in. However since the majority of runs were guild internal runs this fearture was hardly ever used.

 

[Cr0wL0ck]

1) LFG. Not the version where the group is teleported to the instance, obviously, but one where players could announce the desired instance and role and join a common queue instead of desperately spamming Trade or World channels for a group.

LFG actually existed in vanilla although very few know it you used to speak to the innkeeper and then at the stones they would summon a random who had qued at the innkeeper with the correct level.

back then a addon prevailed in LFG called "CallToArms", sadly all who search need to have it, but aside from that it works wonder's. i have been increasing the filter on it and i will try to see if i cant include a wts/wtb tab on it, ill release this sligtly improved version when i release the recommended package i am working on.

 

[Psojed]

The only thing that doesnt require client modifications is the timed instances suggestion, which I highly agree with. I would love cutting the time of an 5man instance from 2 hours to 45 minutes and even making it as a competitive aspect of the game.

Game works normally. When all 5 players of the group enter the instance, a countdown starts. The countdown ends when the group manages to slay the final boss of the instance and if the time was good enough, it is saved into a leaderboard.

Question is, what do we want to spice things up. Either you can make it simply a timer, but if you fail the timer, nothing happens and you can finish your instance normally. Or you could make it so that when the countdown runs out, the players could be automatically teleported outside of the instance and the instance will be reset, but that would probably require something like a .command to set YES/NO if the player wants to run the instance in the competitive mode.

 

[Cr0wL0ck]

i think the leader-board instance timer is a decent idea but i would prefer saving that one for when they are 100% done :wink:

if you want to spice things why not add event's ?
reward could be donation point's the player then gets a 1 time coupon code to insert that gives x amount point's.

event could then be scheduled for the 1st or last day of every month, with a random goal, perhaps a Warcraft trivia hosted in a "event" channel by a GM.

there could even be an AV event where all who enter the AV match, winning team then gets a 1 time event coupon, as a bonus npc's could perhaps be buffed 5-15% for that match and where a GM monitors for leeches.

they could also implement another type of points only gained through events that can be used to purchase the TCG tabard's or a pet :wink:

there are countless methods to spice without affecting anything, but i don't think it needs any spice or at-least not the first year or so :biggrin: Vanilla was and is the greatest:biggrin:

 

[Aieris]

There are events on all Twinstar servers. Rewards are donation points or decent amount of gold (for TBC it's usualy 50g for winner). And Kronos had some Event masters too and i think, that they are still recruiting creative people for this positon.

Edit: The idea of timed run dungeons was there. They wanted to port it from Ares, but never done it.

 

[Cr0wL0ck]

donation point is fine but i dislike the idea of granting gold or usefull items for event's. id prefer if it stayed purely cosmetically the rewards.

at-least that is my opinion :wink:

 

[Lharts]

They don't hand out free stuff here, don't worry.

 

[Psojed]

On TBC they have a new NPC in Shattrath City that allows you to check best times for 5mans (and heroics) and the times reset once in a while.

 

[hbee]

I see my my great ideas were not so unique after all .

How about the technical side of things. I'm not saying that these should be implemented but I'm quite curious of these... Psojed mentioned only the timed instances would be possible to implement without client modification. What kind of client modifications would be required (and within the realm possibilities)? A new API I assume, would it be possible? Or could a newer client be downgraded just for Classic usage? Atleast the UI can be modified to match the Classic by the XML and LUA files found in the MPQ files? Mechanics are obviously done on the server side but what else would have to be changed..?

 

[goris]

Client modifications are against the EULA, thus illegal. Nobody in their right mind would modify the client and then put it up on the website of their well-known private server for people to download.

hammer

 

[Lharts]

You changed the realmlist.wtf already. Also against the EULA.

 

[goris]

I did, twinstar didn't.
Blizzard won't sue me even if I did it, but it could sue twinstar if twinstar did it and spread such client.

(and this really isn't me talking, this is the twinstar team talking)

 

[Lharts]

Even though the core is reverse engineered the boss mechanics and the content are property of blizzard. So if anything they would sue you for that and nothing else.

 

[Aieris]

To the point of the question. Client modifications are possible but:
1. If you do so, everryone will have to use this modified client.
2. You need different version of the emulator, for the version of the client. I'm not sure what would it do, if you use 1.12.1 emu and 3.3.5 client and say to the client, that it's actualy 1.12.1
3. It's not easy thing to do so. As I know, these changes may take years to do.

 

[Zed]

To use a modified client is more a barrier then a feature to attract players.

 

[goris]

Even though the core is reverse engineered the boss mechanics and the content are property of blizzard. So if anything they would sue you for that and nothing else.

well, I am no lawyer, so I don't know about that. Stairway to heaven is a property of Led Zeppelin's record company but they don't sue me when I sing it drunk at a bar. Usually, when it comes to these copyright issues, there seems to be a great difference between cases when the "pirate" is straight selling the pirated stuff, or making profit of of it and when he is not. Which twinstar officialy isn't. They even cancelled player donations a LONG time ago, in order to be totally "clean" and only brought them back after careful consideration and in such a form that they can not be used against them.

But I do know that modifying the client is a big NO-NO on twinstar, and it is mainly because of the legality issues. You can, for example, notice, that they don't even modify the realmlists on the clients that are on their download page. I challenge you to find one good reason why a server would dedicate resources to hosting 4 different game clients and not make them connect to twinstar by default. Modifying the client is a much clearer offense, than determining whether you are hosting an illegal server or not, and as such it is also way easier to prove and punish.

EDIT: And keep in mind, that I'm not talking about little Johnny who modifies his realmlist and plays the game without anyone knowing. Or modifies his client so that the male tauren model looks like a panda(client-side) and plays the game without anyone knowing. I'm talking about a relatively well-known organization that would modify the client, clearly violating the EULA and then put it up on the internet for everyone to see and encourage people to download it and use it instead of the original.

Now, I have no problem accepting that I'm mistaken about this, if a twinstar admin would come and correct me here. But my information and deductions are based on logic and, more importantly, on (multiple) sources from the twinstar team itself. So I higly doubt that such scenario will happen.