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Dungeon Set 2

Leido

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May 12, 2015
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#28
guys, it's not only about the T0.5 or D2 (no matter what you call it) items, it is more about the items that drop directly from the additional bosses that you summon in various dungeons.

like these: https://vanilla-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?item=22329
https://vanilla-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?item=22334
https://vanilla-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?item=22339
Im starting to think that you dont agree with D2 gear because it helps people catch up with current content, and you dont feel happy about people eventually getting your same gear in a (slightly) easier way.
Just focus on your own character; if to be happy with your gear you have to compare it to others', i have bad news for you.
 

Liqorice

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May 12, 2015
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#29
And a lot of these players won't bother anymore when every time they seem to get close gearwise there seems to be a another farm released way before it should actually come out. Gz dude on 60, now go farm silithus bracers / AD gear / farm your preraid BiS oh and now every instance has boss to easily wipe on without raidgear so gl with that too, p.s. you need to do the t0.5 qline too for the +hit gloves. Also farm all consumables for next raid please. GL HF

That's actually more negative than positive for new players. When t0.5 came out it was because it gave non raiders something to do, items were worse than raiditems that raiders were doing at the time(naxx). Right now though some of these items are better than our current raiditems which means for every serious player looking to raid it's another farm on the list, while the farm itself feels fake in a sense, you joined a vanilla realm but suddenly content starts releasing where it shouldn't. If I just joined a realm after my old realm died (happens too much in the pvt realm scene already) I would personally quit before investing all my time in this when this starts happening.
This is your opinion, thanks for sharing.
 

Aieris

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Jan 15, 2009
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#30
I think that staff just want to release content for both, casual and harcore players before school begins so they have time to pay attantion to it. When school begins, there will be much less time to take care of eventual bugs.
 

HBK

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Dec 6, 2012
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#31
Im starting to think that you dont agree with D2 gear because it helps people catch up with current content, and you dont feel happy about people eventually getting your same gear in a (slightly) easier way.
Just focus on your own character; if to be happy with your gear you have to compare it to others', i have bad news for you.
nope sorry, you're plain wrong. my character profits just as much from it as everybody else. i explained it in my previous posts why i think it's bad.
 

Leido

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May 12, 2015
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#32
nope sorry, you're plain wrong. my character profits just as much from it as everybody else. i explained it in my previous posts why i think it's bad.
Then you just dont like casuals playing this game? Cause they are the main public for this gear.
 

Brutus

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Feb 18, 2015
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#33
Well in the end it doesnt matter that much anymore,

if I would have known content with and after silithus will be released that fast, i would have call out my doubts on it aswell. T0,5 more or less doesnt matter now imo. Everything has pros and cons, as usual.

I will just wonder about the long time without new content on the long road to AQ40 and after that to Naxx.
- In the end i hope and believe in that the Kronos-staff thought a lot about it and chose the best option for the long-term motivation and still remaining scripting work of Chero (and others , ofc :)).
 

Aurigon

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Nov 21, 2014
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#34
I'll keep it simple and say that if something isn't blizzlike and isn't actually needed, it should just be left like it was back then.

One of the things I'm hyped about the most, is the AQ War Effort and the gate opening event, the success and epicness of which largely depends on realm numbers. Right now our population is stagnating, meaning that as many new players join as players quit playing.

Rushing content and releasing it earlier might become a double-edged blade, and blizzlike purists might be turned away instead. There's those bloody cross-faction mounts already that scream custom server so loud, I'm certainly not so shallow to imply Kronos is one but imagine a newly created character from a totally new player, they rush to Ironforge or Stormwind to have a peek and guess what the population is like, there they see not so many people, gnomes riding kodos, players with gear they shouldn't have at this content stage, and log out. Then they check the competition, find a totally opposite scenario and... well, a word to the wise.

If you want to diverge from blizzlike retail, set up content to be harder, buff bosses, make gear more difficult to obtain. I'm sure that's what HBK and BlaCkc0der and few others are suggesting. There's something the average vanilla raider will never admit, that within the deepest recesses of their souls they will be left with hunger and will love it with a passion when they see their whole raid group roflstomped by some boss they thought they knew everything about and believed they were on par with gear wise. Over and over again.
 

nimeralos

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Aug 26, 2014
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#35
Guys, it's an announcement, nothing to discuss here. Some pros, some cons. No, I mean - you can discuss because it's entertaining and wholesome for your mind, but keep in it that the decision is already made.

I started to respect Chero's policy more. He don't ask the community - he rules, he says how it will be. And he rules with wisdom. Because if asked, the community will be splitted anyway. Admin must make Decisions, not just listen to different arguments and hestitate forever.
 

bl4ckc0d3r

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May 22, 2015
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#36
He don't ask the community - he rules, he says how it will be. And he rules with wisdom. Because if asked, the community will be splitted anyway. Admin must make Decisions, not just listen to different arguments and hestitate forever.
It's often nice to hear different opinions before making a decision because some people say things one often hasn't thought about.

It was my hope that his decision might change after hearing opinion (and perhaps being convinced by it) of some of us.

There's a reason we play on a 1x realm - we like important things (like content progression) to be blizzlike.
 

nimeralos

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#37
It's often nice to hear different opinions before making a decision because some people say things one often hasn't thought about.
I doubt such an obvious idea that now things gonna be a bit more unBlizzlike, that now gearing and raids will become a bit easier, haven't came to Chero's mind without our help :)

It's nice, it's polite, but it's inefficient. IMHO.
It was my hope that his decision might change after hearing opinion (and perhaps being convinced by it) of some of us.
Sure, we all hope to be heared. But a Decision may be changed only if overwhelmed by community opinion. And such a thing as community opinion exists only in extreme cases, otherwise there're only competing opinions of members.

Sorry, overphilosophed. Underslept. Generally I agree with you :) But.
 
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Aieris

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Jan 15, 2009
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#38
Well, It's good to discuss those things, but, as you can see, opinions are even, some players welcome it as a nice catch up mechanic and something more to keep players busy and keep 5 man dungeons running while others see it as harm to the game balance. And who should devs trust?

I personaly belive, that AQ will be hard, because most players have not experience with it, because most players have not ever been there, nor on retail, nor on private server. Dungeons are getting easy when you have experience with them. Reading the tactics is good, but untill you were there, you don't know what exactly you should expect. And AQ is raid, which most players never cleared.
 

Aurigon

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Nov 21, 2014
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#39
I personaly belive, that AQ will be hard, because most players have not experience with it, because most players have not ever been there, nor on retail, nor on private server. Dungeons are getting easy when you have experience with them. Reading the tactics is good, but untill you were there, you don't know what exactly you should expect. And AQ is raid, which most players never cleared.
In respect to that, I bet Naxxramas is where the most laughter will be truly had at
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
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Location
Norway
#40
It could be so much more. and in my opinion it should have been more (of a challenge). The only little challenge was getting enough dispels going on Chromaggus, but a small set-up adjustment already does the trick.

so yeah, i think the numbers showed that BWL was indeed too easy.
More of a challenge for you or the rest? It really sounds like you want harder bosses, because a few pieces of correctly itemized gear won't make much of a difference. If anything, address world buffs, because last reset a warlock streamed with 3xDMF, DM, Dragonslayer, Songflower, even the god damn Silithyst buff and the impressive DS+DM bug for 10%+10% damage. Looking at that obscene amount of potential buffs I think it's silly to argue against a couple of % hit and AP/SP. It's easily 35-40% higher raid performance with full buffs, and this badge-gear pales in comparison.

Oh, and I think new PvP'ers are grateful for actually having the possibility to get some gear so they don't have to be completely asswiped by BWL-PvE'ers with Ashkandi and Drakefang Shoulder's day in day out for 2 months before they get some blue PvP-gear. It's not ONLY the ring, staff and gloves for spell-hit, you know.
 

Lharts

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Nov 29, 2012
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#42
Oh, and I think new PvP'ers are grateful for actually having the possibility to get some gear so they don't have to be completely asswiped by BWL-PvE'ers with Ashkandi and Drakefang Shoulder's day in day out for 2 months before they get some blue PvP-gear. It's not ONLY the ring, staff and gloves for spell-hit, you know.
Spot on.
If you never started out new on a server where guilds already progress into BWL you don't know what its like.
T0.5 is heaven sent.
 

HBK

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Dec 6, 2012
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#43
well, just please try to understand what i'm saying... even if you don't agree with my point of view.
of course the D2 quest chain is not destroying the server by itself. it's just a little load.
however, it's a little load on top of all the other little loads and they stack up to something pretty big. you know what i'm saying?

playing here with 1.12 talents and the revamped pre raid gear from patch 1.10 (AQ was 1.9) already makes all the content quite a lot easier than it was back in the day, at least everything up until naxx, including AQ.
Even AQ is gonna be pretty easy for the experienced and dedicated kinds of players. Mages will run around with the op fire specc which increases their dps so greatly compared to frost now and Mages didn't have that specc available back in late 2005 when AQ opened. This again will be another little load on top of the pile that makes everything easier. And i think the dungeon and more importantly the server doesn't deserve this.

These things are exactly what turned me off from retail after WotLK, because Blizzard, in my opinion, made the mistake of making their endgame content too accessible.

And all the extra content that has been implemented very late on retail has now become available so early here on Kronos, that it actually piles up to a big load of stuff that makes everything (too) easy. For the casual player, all these things are being welcomed, i get that, but what's there for the people that are more 'dedicated'? (i'm not gonna use the word that starts with 'h' cause that word is being well over-used on private servers)

those players don't get challenged at all by the endgame content, at least not so far. And i would really like Chero to give something to those kinds of players aswell.
Just look how blizzard used to always do it, in the beginning, the endgame content is balanced pretty toughly and they let players struggle a little bit (of course, the factor of unknown content plays a big role there and all of the vanilla content is well known, but anyway..) and after players have overcome that challenge ... they nerfed it a little bit to make it more accessible to casual players. And for me, that's the perfect way of presenting content.
Make it harder in the beginning, give people a challenge and ease it up later on for all people.

It will definitely help for the longevity of the server if things are not always doable for everybody. Imagine Naxxramas being cleared the same week it opens, horrible scenario for the server in my opnion.

So yeah, of course things can't be reverted, but they can learn from it and get solutions for the future. Spice AQ up, spice Naxx up, because only that way, the server will have longevity. You don't know how many people would quit when their guild clears Naxxramas shortly after the release, many of those people will have their goal achieved and just leave. You can't tell me that's good.

And lastly regarding world buffs: you can't blame the people for using worldbuffs and say, 'well that's why it's too easy for you'. of course people use everything that's available and that is what server admins (game developers, designers) always have to keep in mind. People will make use of everything you present to them. So you have to make sure your endgame content holds up against that (at least in the beginning).
You can't tell the people 'just don't use these things and you'll have a challenge'!
come on man, you know that's bollocks and doesn't work :)
 
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Leido

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May 12, 2015
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#44
And all the extra content that has been implemented very late on retail has now become available so early here on Kronos, that it actually piles up to a big load of stuff that makes everything (too) easy. For the casual player, all these things are being welcomed, i get that, but what's there for the people that are more 'dedicated'? (i'm not gonna use the word that starts with 'h' cause that word is being well over-used on private servers)
Man thats just plain elitist. If you want, go do your progression with not preraid bis items and no epics.
Also, stop trying to get the same experience as 11 years ago cause its not gonna happen. Its impossible that you give the players exactly the same experience. Just stop daydreaming.
 
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#46
well, just please try to understand what i'm saying... even if you don't agree with my point of view.
(Not quoting everything). I get your point, and that's fair enough, I just personally don't think it's enough to delay Silithus, AD, D2 etc. if it's a challenge we want. It would have to be like Feenix, with triple HP on bosses and harder hitting abilities, and even then we would probably just work around it like we did there, because we know no limits:

- Every player with a 60 Warlock alt for best SS.
- (Horde) Getting a 60 Priest and 3 Paladins on alliance side for mind control + 3x blessings.
- A raid before the raid summoning people like ping-pong-balls around the world for every buff conceivable.
- Logging on every 4 hours for 24 hours getting 5-6 DMF buffs.
-
The list of absurdities goes on :) The framework we currently play on don't really support being "hard", and if it is, it forces us to do a lot of stupid things.
 

Alibagil

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Apr 23, 2013
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#47
Rushing content is not great BUT, you have to understand the server point-of-view in trying to get raiders from Nost transfer to TS, with the latest two content changes (BWL and D2) it's a lot easier for such players to switch, an alternative for that being a form of character transfer which I believe almost no one would like, even if it was possible, so - be glad we're and always will be a step forward before Nost and enjoy the game :p
 
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#48
Rushing content is not great BUT, you have to understand the server point-of-view in trying to get raiders from Nost transfer to TS, with the latest two content changes (BWL and D2) it's a lot easier for such players to switch, an alternative for that being a form of character transfer which I believe almost no one would like, even if it was possible, so - be glad we're and always will be a step forward before Nost and enjoy the game :p
If, and I say if, a full guild raiding guild decides to switch, I'm also OK with them being able to get these items in order to be competitive quickly. The alternative is to wait months and months to deck players with the few stand-out items which have no real equivalents.
 

Soyoen

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Sep 28, 2014
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#49
Welcome to Kronos, the best private vanilla custom fun server.
Spice AQ up, spice Naxx up, because only that way, the server will have longevity. You don't know how many people would quit when their guild clears Naxxramas shortly after the release, many of those people will have their goal achieved and just leave. You can't tell me that's good.

Fuck everyone out there who set out a goal for themselves and went on and achieved it. If those individuals achieved their goals then they better fucking remain in their guilds for the rest of their lives or they dead. We gon hunt em down like pigs if they leave after they achieved something, cause achieving something is not fucking acceptable here.
Fixed it for you mate.


On a more serious topic
If you want a challenge in vanilla content:

1) Do not use all potions/flasks/worldbuffs
2) Use a raid setup with non viable specs and classes
3) Reduce your raid size by 25-75%

- - - Updated - - -

Raiding guilds will not switch from Nost without character transfers which wont happen. Who in their right mind would switch realms if their realm works fine in dungeons/raids and they have >30days invested on the realm? Who would leave all their friends behind for the great possibility of doing everything all over again? The players likely to switch are those pre60 who gets ganked a lot/can't stand the ability delay in the world and likewise - no guild will ever switch unless they are forced off the realm or the realm becomes unbearable.
 

nimeralos

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#50
12.12 is the end of the semester (afaik). Lets just wait till then and see.
BTW, Semester ends at 19.12 on most universities in CZ and exams start at 2.1
I think that staff just want to release content for both, casual and harcore players before school begins so they have time to pay attantion to it. When school begins, there will be much less time to take care of eventual bugs.
I'm sorry if it sounds rude or something, but, well, Chero's still studying atm? Should we except some slowdown in a developement & bugfixing process? Would be interesting to, well, just know. This silent months of autumn 2014 was... unpleasant. I don't mean any disrespect, just asking.
 
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