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.join vs logic

Orravan

New Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Likes
1
#76
That's exactly what happened on K3, though. In addition to a certain Horde premade group splitting up and camping level 50 FP's during their queues.

Yeah, that's precisely what I was missing here. Beside being lame af, it's terribly sad.
 

NotSachi

Authorized
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Likes
138
#77
yo i didn't read the thread but expecting logic from kronos is like expecting factual information from fox news
 

Flash

Head Kronos GameMaster & Lead Tester
Joined
Jul 15, 2018
Likes
26
#78
Wow, this has been some interesting reading to say the least.

The battleground command had a positive and negative effect on the server. We decided to remove the command above level 49 because we wanted to reduce the corpse camping at level 50+ zones which lead to other problems.


What caused the corpse-camping, flight master, quest-giver and generally higher level area ganking?
First of all. It's not against the rules to corpse camp anyone. Doesn't matter if there's a level or number difference.

You need to know what was going on at that time. We had two pvp brackets, the level 60 and level 59 bracket. There were more players at the level 59 bracket than 60 which caused a lot of issues when it came to ranking. We also had a faction imbalance. There are more horde than alliance players so the 60+ minute long queue were only happening on horde.

Players who were level 60 didn't get enough honor for the week to keep their rank or even progress. The reason was because there weren't enough battlegrounds, long queue time and they were falling behind in honor. Their solution was to visit the level 50+ zones while sitting in the long queue and kill anyone for that extra honor. It worked for the most part but had some negative effects. The negative part was that it prevented lot of players from potentially reaching level 60. They couldn't do any quests before getting ambushed by 60s. Making it almost impossible to level up.


solutions?
Our goal was to encourage players to step into the level 60 battlegrounds while also reduce the corpse camping at level 50+ zones. Our solution were the following,
  • Increase the level requirement for the pvp items to level 60.
  • Update the stats to patch 1.12.
  • Add all pvp items to the vendor.
  • Disable battleground command above level 50.
  • reduce honor gained from non 60s.
By increasing the level requirement to level 60, it would force the players from the level 59 bracket to actually level up. This would've increased the battlegrounds for the 60s. Adding all pvp items to the vendor and updating the stats to patch 1.12. would encourage dedicated pvers in raiding guilds to start ranking in order to get the gear that would boost them in raids. Disable the battleground command while also reduce the honor gained by non 60s would lower the amount of corpse camping in the level 50+ zones, giving players time to breathe and actually start leveling again.


It's been two months since we implemented these changes, has there been some positive results?
The battleground queues at level 60 are okayish, it's around 5-20 minutes rather than 60+ minutes. The camping has reduced by a good amount. There's still a few flight master/quest-giver corpse camping taking place but it's only around NA time since there's not enough battlegrounds up at that point.
 
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Topmong

Authorized
Joined
Apr 11, 2016
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181
Location
Finland
#79
You forgot to mention that another server went live and Kronos had a really heavy population drop, which was arguably the biggest factor in anything happening to the pvp issues on Kronos. None of the changes you made were timely, nor had much of an effect.

You also forgot to mention that you weren't willing to make crucial changes until your boys in <Vanguard> were done ranking. For example, this was promptly hidden upon submission, and unsurprisingly made public again and marked pending for an update the same week Threewords finished his ranking.
 
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Flash

Head Kronos GameMaster & Lead Tester
Joined
Jul 15, 2018
Likes
26
#80
You're not wrong, another project did have a new server released which had an effect on the kronos population, both in PvP and PvE. Summer also hand an effect on the population, can't ignore that. People want to spend time outside, travel or have fun with their friends and loved ones.

Criticizing the staff team by accusing us of only helping one individual without being able to provide any evidence is not a wise move but I do understand your point of view. This bug report wasn't being looked into untill a few members of the community managed to get my attention on Kronos discord. I looked into the report and took it to our developers, they managed to find the issue which later got fixed. Reports can sometimes be pushed to the side because of other reports that may have a higher priority. You may not agree with it but you're entitled to your own opinion.
 

Topmong

Authorized
Joined
Apr 11, 2016
Likes
181
Location
Finland
#81
The fact that you feel addressed enough to write such a thoughtless, rushed reply alone does more work proving me right than I ever could. You're basically admitting that your developer team is incapable to pay attention to your bug tracker which moves at the stunning speed of five new actions a day. From a commercial point of view, probably not a wise move to make. It would've been much less harmful to just say that Chero was away for his finals, summer holiday or whatnot.

In advance, when someone with no authority to their name like me (I've publicly admitted on this board that I don't even play on Kronos 3) makes a personal jab at you, outing your status or calling out your misdeeds, it's better to not reply. You must have trust in your figure of authority over those you govern, or you will have none. Or worse, you end up putting those above you in a poor light by what you write on public boards as a member of administration.
 

Davros

New Member
Joined
Aug 20, 2015
Likes
555
#82
The fact you would rip into one of my team members for trying to be helpful by giving you a reply shows me that you're an unappreciative person. People complain that our team don't provide enough communication, and yet when a team member tries to be helpful you shit all over them. You can't have it both ways. He did his best to explain how things work on our end, it's our job to bring issues to our Devs attention and get fixed. The Devs choose which issues get fixed and when based on numerous criteria such as severity, amount of affected players, impact on the server, etc... So instead of giving my staff grief, if you have an issue then bring it up to me on Discord PM.
 
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Retherz

Authorized
Joined
Aug 1, 2017
Likes
24
#83
The fact you would rip into one of my team members for trying to be helpful by giving you a reply shows me that you're an unappreciative person. People complain that our team don't provide enough communication, and yet when a team member tries to be helpful you shit all over them. You can't have it both ways. He did his best to explain how things work on our end, it's our job to bring issues to our Devs attention and get fixed. The Devs choose which issues get fixed and when based on numerous criteria such as severity, amount of affected players, impact on the server, etc... So instead of giving my staff grief, if you have an issue then bring it up to me on Discord PM.
hi dude can i get unbanned on the kronos discord?
 

Sarei

Authorized
Joined
Feb 9, 2016
Likes
396
#84
Anyone else just not reading what Crowlock writes for 4 months now?
I fucking swear to God, I really try to read his posts every time, but my brain just keeps refusing to get into 2nd line since months ago. Even when he used to quote me and write directly to me, I would take a deep breath and try to concentrate as hard as I can to read at least that but it wouldn't help. Every time my brain would shut down before I'd be done with the first sentence and I would never be able to read more then that. I say this with zero exaggerating.
 

Riplin

New Member
Joined
Jul 9, 2018
Likes
4
#85
I'm in NA and play evenings and there are no BGs. You're lucky if you get *only* an hour queue. Last night, (AB weekend) I finally logged after waiting over 3 hours. Oh there's plenty of Horde waiting around, but once the single alliance pre-made calls it quits BGs are just done for the day.

I don't see how removing .join really matters that much. The queue times are so atrociously long that your hearth will be back every time, or you just take 10 mins to fly wherever.

I think at this point horde are just hoping AV will finally bring out all the casuals so we can get some actual games going.
 

Akka

Authorized
Joined
Nov 19, 2015
Likes
19
#86
So I don't quite understand the reasoning from people complaining about that feature.
Honestly, if you "don't understand", it's probably because you haven't read anything at all about the complaints.
You describe yourself as not attacking people who can't fight back, while the change is about reducing the time spent in the wild for people who do exactly that. So basically you're saying "well I don't speed at all when I drive, so putting more speed camera won't change my behaviour !". Well, newsflash : it will change the behaviour of the people who speed.

And also :
On the other hand, PvE-oriented players gotta understand that world PvP, at its core, isn't about griefing.
*insert a huge LOL image here*

Please. I've played the game since release day on retail, and I've played several pserver. World PvP IS all about griefing. It's next to never about anything else.
Non-griefing world PvP is actually so rare that I can actually remember from the top of my head the number of times I've been engaged in a "fair fight" (i.e. by a character around my level while I'm not already fighting a mob or another Horde and with more than 75 % health) on Kronos III, and it's four. Among dozens over dozens over dozens ganking. So let me laugh again a good deal at the legend of "interesting fights is the reason for world PvP".

In short : this is BS. World PvP is about griefing, it's about annoying others, it's about having a power trip, it's about lvl 60 camping low-level area because it maximizes the annoyance.
A last note, about the feature itself.
Back in Vanilla, most people willingly joined PvP servers and thus were expecting to fight other players, so the queues were more easily filled, as people were eager to fight and focused more on PvP.
On private servers mixing up PvP and PvE-oriented players, it's not that much the case, and being able to queue on the go is a tremendous workaround to avoid having to wait an hour for a BG to open.
That was the reasoning behind adding the feature. The problem is that this reasoning fail to take into account that people who want to PvP go massively Horde, so most of those who are eager to join end up on the same side, and so wait... wait... wait... while those who aren't interested are on the other side.
So it ends up with people who want to PvP but can't (because queue) are roaming the world and ganking those who don't want to PvP (and are as such not only forced to participate, but usually against people with a much higher level and PvP gear), making for a bad experience for all. Removing the .join command at least forces the gankers to take 10-15 minutes to come back to the ganking area, which not only reduces their presence, but also cause a lot of them to not bother.
 
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NotSachi

Authorized
Joined
Oct 28, 2015
Likes
138
#87
Criticizing the staff team by accusing us of only helping one individual without being able to provide any evidence is not a wise move but I do understand your point of view
idk dude, historically there seem to be a conspicuous amount of cases of bugs or changes being made at until vanguard's convenience. I think that he the man made a pretty reasonable assumption. OR are those all isolated cases? Kinda like how there is no police brutality against people of color in the US. Those are also all just isolated cases where the innocent unarmed victims who gets shot just happened to be black.

The fact you would rip into one of my team members for trying to be helpful by giving you a reply shows me that you're an unappreciative person. People complain that our team don't provide enough communication, and yet when a team member tries to be helpful you shit all over them.
m8 he isn't ripping him cause he's explaining and i'm sure he's appreciative of the response. i think it's just the whole admitting to incompetence that doesn't sit well.

Also if honor for 60's was the issue why didn't u just bring back sand farming? That would've been great. 60's could've farmed sand and sub-60's wouldnt be able to compete against that. 200 honor per sand is blizzlike too! I hear kronos is all about blizzlike nowadays.

edit: y em i even here:?

edit2: o ye unban me from discord 2 lol
 
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Boogalah

New Member
Joined
May 17, 2018
Likes
21
#89
Should allow .join for alliance for us NA players. I have played a total of 5 BG's from lvl 1-60. I get plenty of WPvP anywhere i go for quests and i believe its because the alliance doesnt q up during NA times so the horde roam the world looking for honor.

I would love to Q up more but the wait isn't worth it. Better off camping horde FP's throughout the day than joining a BG
 

Orravan

New Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Likes
1
#90
Honestly, if you "don't understand", it's probably because you haven't read anything at all about the complaints.
You describe yourself as not attacking people who can't fight back, while the change is about reducing the time spent in the wild for people who do exactly that.
Had you read my latest posts, you would have noticed that I already acknowledged to have missed the key element behind this decision, i.e. 60 premade cheap fucks exploiting the .join command to roam 50-60 regions and farm easy HKs.
There isn't much more to add about it.


Please. I've played the game since release day on retail, and I've played several pserver. World PvP IS all about griefing. It's next to never about anything else.
This is just your own, very opinionated feeling.

You're not the only one here with experiences and memories.
I did play the game from release day too, up to late TBC. Maybe the European servers I played on weren't as much plagued with cheap fucks as the US servers were, or maybe they were just about the same. Notwithstanding, retail vanilla world PvP was still perfectly okay from my point of view, and your own experience of it sounds very peculiar, at best.

There were greykilling, griefing and camping going on, but the crushing majority of fights happened within the boundaries of what a PvP server is ideally supposed to be about: non-consensual PvP between characters of similar levels.
And it's quite logical, because the world design make it so. As you level up, you're bound to meet players of the same level range, because each region offers quests only for a very specific level range.

As a result, most hostile players you'll meet as you grind and level up will be in your level range, as there is practically no reason for you to hang in a region where you don't belong anymore.

Thus when you claim to only have experienced ganks from people you couldn't defend yourself against, what you're actually telling here is that you just avoided getting involved into world PvP entirely as you levelled up (which have me wondering why you decided to play on a PvP server to begin with, but whatever).
So it only makes sense that the situations you were confronted to were the ones you couldn't escape: way higher level players out to grief lowbies.

Purposely missing out on the countless opportunities to engage in PvP with people your level range doesn't mean those situations doesn't exist for the rest of us. You simply ignored them all along. By choice.
And it's applies not only to retail vanilla, but to K3 too. Most of the PvP fights I experienced levelling up were perfectly okay, and whenever I faced more than I could realistically chew on, I simply grouped up to balance the odds. And sometimes lost nonetheless. Which is fine because that's part of the game.

By the way, as a Hordie, my first retail server had a terrifying 2 for 1 ratio in favour of the Alliance, so I think I got a good grasp of what having to deal with uneven factions on a PvP server feels like, and I've had my own, oh very filling share of corpse camps and indiscriminate ganks.
I'm well aware of what being actually griefed feels like.


Non-griefing world PvP is actually so rare that I can actually remember from the top of my head the number of times I've been engaged in a "fair fight" (i.e. by a character around my level while I'm not already fighting a mob or another Horde and with more than 75 % health) on Kronos III, and it's four. Among dozens over dozens over dozens ganking. So let me laugh again a good deal at the legend of "interesting fights is the reason for world PvP".
Yeah, well the problem is that people seem to label virtually anything negative happening to them as "griefing" nowadays.

Corpse camping is griefing alright. So is killing somebody 20 levels below yours.
Getting jumped on as you're fighting a mob, as cheap as it is, isn't griefing. It's part of the core rules of any open-world PvP game, it's perfectly fine and to be expected, and it's down to you to not behave as you would on a safe PvE server.
It's down to you to watch your surroundings, get better by learning from your mistakes, call for reinforcements if you're outnumbered, and grow a spine.

Even if my own ROE is to avoid engaging people fighting mobs, I'm okay with it happening to me and I accept it for what it is: an integral part of a PvP server.
If you're not okay with the idea, if you'd rather have a comfortable and safe control over your interactions with other players, and guaranteed fair fights, you shouldn't be playing on a PvP server. It's as simple as that.
On a PvP server, people are not at fault for attacking you, you're at fault for expecting they won't and not taking any self-protective measures.

And to be honest, dealing with an enemy player while you're engaged on a mob usually isn't that hard. All classes have some kind of CC capabilities allowing you to delay the confrontation as you disengage from your mob by losing aggro.
More often than not, I can manage to either fend it off or escape. You should always be expecting to get ambushed and prepare for it. That's part of the thrill and purposes of PvP servers.


In short : this is BS. World PvP is about griefing, it's about annoying others, it's about having a power trip, it's about lvl 60 camping low-level area because it maximizes the annoyance.
Allow me to say that the actual bullshit is what you wrote right there. That's a twisted, judgemental and strongly opionated statement, and a very surprising one from somebody claiming to have played retail vanilla PvP servers.
If you actually did, you're not only incredibly delusional about the motives and dynamics of PvP ; you're also pretty much a masochist.


So it ends up with people who want to PvP but can't (because queue)
Now that's a very interesting statement right there, the most interesting actually, because it tells a lot about how reductive and wrong your idea of PvP is.

It perfectly illustrates what I wrote a couple days ago:
It feels like they low-key believe that PvP basically belongs to BGs (even though BGs were introduced 7 months after release)
(...)
Anyway, in the end, the "problem" lies with PvE-oriented players expecting to be able to play on a PvP server pretty much like they would on a PvE server, which is outright delusion.
You're literally implying that people are doing world PvP only because they can't enter BGs fast enough. That's a whole lot of crap.

World PvP is the oldest form of PvP in mmorpgs, including WoW, and certainly not a mere surrogate to BGs. If anything, it might be the other way around.

Since you're clearly not into it, you're deciding that world PvP is trash and people doing it are just RL assholes out to ruin somebody else's game.
It doesn't occur to you that it might be attractive and fun because people simply enjoy fighting other players, that the thrill of feeling unsafe, risking getting jumped on is enjoyable, that dynamic and unscripted skirmishes are fun, and that, fucking again, it's the whole point of a PvP server.

A final note on this: if you're only doing PvP in BG, you WILL be shit in world PvP, no matter what. Because those are two different kinds of PvP experiences.


tl;dr: The main reason people are doing world PvP isn't because they're assholes, but because it's part of the game and they enjoy the fights, and it's your own responsibility to assess the threats and take adequates measures to decently counter them. Period.
 

Akka

Authorized
Joined
Nov 19, 2015
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19
#91
Thus when you claim to only have experienced ganks from people you couldn't defend yourself against, what you're actually telling here is that you just avoided getting involved into world PvP entirely as you levelled up (which have me wondering why you decided to play on a PvP server to begin with, but whatever).
So it only makes sense that the situations you were confronted to were the ones you couldn't escape: way higher level players out to grief lowbies.
Purposely missing out on the countless opportunities to engage in PvP with people your level range doesn't mean those situations doesn't exist for the rest of us. You simply ignored them all along. By choice.
No, your argument doesn't make sense. That I didn't initiate PvP doesn't mean that I wouldn't be attacked by people in fair fight, if that was what they were REALLY after. That's even the whole point of your previous paragraphs, where you point that in retail, you would organically encounter mainly people of your own level range (I agree on the latter, BTW, and I also agree that retail had a MUCH lower rate of raw griefing compared to the unbelievably toxic behaviour on Kronos).

As for why I was on a PvP server, it's due to my friends who made this choice. Simple as that, and not what I would have prefered.
Yeah, well the problem is that people seem to label virtually anything negative happening to them as "griefing" nowadays.

Corpse camping is griefing alright. So is killing somebody 20 levels below yours.
Getting jumped on as you're fighting a mob, as cheap as it is, isn't griefing. It's part of the core rules of any open-world PvP game, it's perfectly fine and to be expected, and it's down to you to not behave as you would on a safe PvE server.
It's down to you to watch your surroundings, get better by learning from your mistakes, call for reinforcements if you're outnumbered, and grow a spine.
Griefing has a simple definition : it's something that is done out of a desire to annoy others.
Killing me while I'm low on life or fighting three mob isn't in itself griefing (after all, I do bring honor). It's NOT about "having fun with challenging PvP fight" (which is the point where I disagree with your rosy description of PvP servers), because there is no fight and no way that I defend myself, but it might be done to gain honor or to get me out of the spot, so even if I despise it, I don't call it "griefing".

Killing grey, lowering the life of someone so that mob kill him and he gets a 10 % repair bill, camping, insulting emotes, tea-bagging, locking up low-level zones, are all griefing, though : these don't bring anything to the player doing it, and their whole point is to piss off others. That's the very definition of griefing. That's also, incidentally, about 90 % of the actual PvP happening in Kronos.

Oh and please, "grow a spine" ? That sounds like trash talk from schoolyard. You can do better.
If you're not okay with the idea, if you'd rather have a comfortable and safe control over your interactions with other players, and guaranteed fair fights, you shouldn't be playing on a PvP server. It's as simple as that.
As you pointed on your previous post : there is no decent private PvE server. So you kinda explained this and defeated this argument yourself already.

Also, I don't fault people for attacking me. What I point is that PvP is NOT, as you claim, about "having fun with challenging fights", becaue next to no fight in wPvP is "fair". It's about jumping on people when they have the lowest chance to defend themselves.
Don't misunderstand my point : It's tactically sound, I don't say "they shouldn't do it". It's part of a PvP server. But it's NOT about challenge, it's NOT about "fair". I get that people can be thrilled by the constant danger on PvP server, by the possibility of fighting others, but I'm just annoyed by how often I see the argument "I like challenge and having a good surprise fight with people" compared to the actual reality of "you'll get a fair fight 5 % of the time, and get jumped when unable to defend yourself 95 % of the time". Does not fit.
You're literally implying that people are doing world PvP only because they can't enter BGs fast enough. That's a whole lot of crap.
That's factual, at least on Kronos. Since .join has been disabled, there has been a lot less random ganking (still a ton, but a LOT less). For someone accusing me of projecting wrong ideas, I think you're just in denial about what most PvPer are about.
 
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Cr0wL0ck

New Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Likes
162
#92
They could simply grant the FP master & pets the same immunities as a boss thus they cannot be kited, even a hunter would be in trouble as the flying pets summoned are crazy fast and hurt even for a tank. That would be a lot more effective than simply disabling .join for high levels as just disabling .join only reduces pvp but it does not prevent those who want to kite kill FP's from doing so.

Funny thing is people who wish to play on a pve server are the ones complaining... it is a well known fact that pve servers dont live long and no decent pve server exists... so why should any server comply to requests originating from being killed in world pvp in order to be more pve server'ish ?

With less battlegrounds and longer ques of course people will hunt more world pvp so not only does it not benefit those who cried much it literally makes it more important for PvP'ers to spend more time while in que doing world pvp and a FP luckily only takes 3-7 min. while a que takes 20-45 min. easily for the horde. even if you flew 50 times you would perhaps at most have spent 1 gold and that is certainly not what pvp'ers lack...

Akka you say it is factual people gank others less but where does this fact come from ? do you have any source or can it be googled ? or is it personal experience/perspective ? personally i gank quite a few especially when i am farming cloth. The only battleground i have done since the disabling of .join was AV until i got exalted but aside from that i get honor through hunting and killing innocent players near my farm location and to keep myself secure i gank them until they run away. I also gank people when i am leveling alts... i am about to lvl my 4th crafting alt soon and guess what... all the alliance i see i kill and likewise alliance try to gank me upon sight...

when people joined a battleground through .join at least the prey had an estimate of 10-20 min. getting away if not 40-60 min. for longer fights.
And with a shorter que they could gank and track or disturb you even less...

but if you extend que by less quing up then its only a 3-5 min. flight usually and they might not target you but whoever comes in sight first but if that happens to be you then it would be more of a ganking case than what you had before when the que was a lot shorter and thus more likely you could escape... you even state that 90% of the pvp on kronos is 1 person killing another with a mob... have you ever entered a battleground ? count the deaths please also the killing of another player while he is in pve is part of what makes it a pvp server... and no it does not make up 90% of all the actual pvp...

Don't try to change a pvp server into pve just becourse your friends dragged you here... you wouldnt try to change a shooting game into a melee combat game either. If you don't like what they play you simply play something else. If you dislike being killed in wpvp then simply run around inside the capital and only accept summons to dungeon and raids and carry some tools to escape pvp, you should probably play paladin its the perfect coward class to avoid pvp if you combine it with the gnomish cloacking device.
 
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Retherz

Authorized
Joined
Aug 1, 2017
Likes
24
#93
They could simply grant the FP master & pets the same immunities as a boss thus they cannot be kited, even a hunter would be in trouble as the flying pets summoned are crazy fast and hurt even for a tank. That would be a lot more effective than simply disabling .join for high levels as just disabling .join only reduces pvp but it does not prevent those who want to kite kill FP's from doing so.

Funny thing is people who wish to play on a pve server are the ones complaining... it is a well known fact that pve servers dont live long and no decent pve server exists... so why should any server comply to requests originating from being killed in world pvp in order to be more pve server'ish ?

With less battlegrounds and longer ques of course people will hunt more world pvp so not only does it not benefit those who cried much it literally makes it more important for PvP'ers to spend more time while in que doing world pvp and a FP luckily only takes 3-7 min. while a que takes 20-45 min. easily for the horde. even if you flew 50 times you would perhaps at most have spent 1 gold and that is certainly not what pvp'ers lack...

Akka you say it is factual people gank others less but where does this fact come from ? do you have any source or can it be googled ? or is it personal experience/perspective ? personally i gank quite a few especially when i am farming cloth. The only battleground i have done since the disabling of .join was AV until i got exalted but aside from that i get honor through hunting and killing innocent players near my farm location and to keep myself secure i gank them until they run away. I also gank people when i am leveling alts... i am about to lvl my 4th crafting alt soon and guess what... all the alliance i see i kill and likewise alliance try to gank me upon sight...

when people joined a battleground through .join at least the prey had an estimate of 10-20 min. getting away if not 40-60 min. for longer fights.
And with a shorter que they could gank and track or disturb you even less...

but if you extend que by less quing up then its only a 3-5 min. flight usually and they might not target you but whoever comes in sight first but if that happens to be you then it would be more of a ganking case than what you had before when the que was a lot shorter and thus more likely you could escape... you even state that 90% of the pvp on kronos is 1 person killing another with a mob... have you ever entered a battleground ? count the deaths please also the killing of another player while he is in pve is part of what makes it a pvp server... and no it does not make up 90% of all the actual pvp...

Don't try to change a pvp server into pve just becourse your friends dragged you here... you wouldnt try to change a shooting game into a melee combat game either. If you don't like what they play you simply play something else. If you dislike being killed in wpvp then simply run around inside the capital and only accept summons to dungeon and raids and carry some tools to escape pvp, you should probably play paladin its the perfect coward class to avoid pvp if you combine it with the gnomish cloacking device.
my man crowlock laying down the law! :cool:
 
Joined
Aug 25, 2018
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0
#94
I can see both points of view, it seems .join added an advantage to anyone trying to Rank Up by having an infinite resource of honor, by staying QUE'D While they Farm HKs and able to instantly hop into a BG for More Honor. Its not Technically an EXPLOIT but its pretty close. Like everything else in life it seems amazing on paper but when applied to the public things go a lil Side Ways. The FIX to this seems pretty hard to narrow down, it would require ALOT of work on the DEV'S. The only way i can see it working if you removed Honor from WPVP to keep people from Corpse Camping, Killing @ FP and Ganking (lvl 60's killing 51+)
 

Retherz

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Aug 1, 2017
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#95
I can see both points of view, it seems .join added an advantage to anyone trying to Rank Up by having an infinite resource of honor, by staying QUE'D While they Farm HKs and able to instantly hop into a BG for More Honor. Its not Technically an EXPLOIT but its pretty close. Like everything else in life it seems amazing on paper but when applied to the public things go a lil Side Ways. The FIX to this seems pretty hard to narrow down, it would require ALOT of work on the DEV'S. The only way i can see it working if you removed Honor from WPVP to keep people from Corpse Camping, Killing @ FP and Ganking (lvl 60's killing 51+)
this has already been suggested but crowlock debunked it
 
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