Ok, I think it's time for a release date on BWL...

[Zipzo]

I'm bumping because I think this is important.

I think now is a really good time to actually beat Nos to the punch at something. If there's anything to be learned by their massive population success over Kronos, it's that people don't care about branding or who's backing the server. That's all just a bonus. They just want content, and they beat Kronos to the punch on release.

I dare say that a BWL/AV release would actually cause people to roll over to Kronos from wherever they are. MC is boring. It's by far some of the worst gear Blizzard has ever designed and by far some of the easiest encounters designed simply to acclimate people with the 40m environment.

They are sitting on their laurels over there and people are wondering if they ever intended to follow the time-line at all, this would be a really good time to be the first to give a real, serious estimate on when we can expect to see BWL release, it would drive serious hype and competitive, which benefits even the players who remain there.

There is really nothing but a positive list of reasons why giving us a date on BWL/AV would be an excellent thing for Kronos.

Before people come at me with "more people need to be 60! more people have to clear MC!".

No.

There's several horde guilds who have cleared Rag/Ony and more that have cleared up to Rag, and a handful of guilds on alliance have cleared all or close to all of the content as well. If you didn't make it, you didn't make it at this point. This tier is easy, it's not meant to be dragged out so that everyone gets a swing. There was only a short window of time during actual, retail vanilla where when you began playing, MC was the only future prospective raiding instance awaiting you. Most people had BWL to look forward to when they began, as that's when the game began picking up serious steam.

The worst thing that you can do right now is glaze the drive of your current 60 population. If you bore the heck out of your current 60 population, they will turn away from the game. Right now the focus should be on cultivating your current population of high level characters. Driving content releases to match their speed, and this in turn will create new players in droves due to the prospect of there being so much available content for them should they dedicate themselves to rolling anew on Kronos. ZG and AV would seriously be sprinkles and a cherry on top, but BWL I think is really what can drive this.

Give us a date, or at least an estimate. We only stand to benefit in many ways.

 

[jobbe]

Give us a date, or at least an estimate. We only stand to benefit in many ways.

This, it does not mean we need or want it NOW! (as some people reading the previous posts assumed right away) but rather a set date for people and guilds who are planning ahead.

 

[Liqorice]

I'm bumping because I think this is important.

I think now is a really good time to actually beat Nos to the punch at something. If there's anything to be learned by their massive population success over Kronos, it's that people don't care about branding or who's backing the server. That's all just a bonus. They just want content, and they beat Kronos to the punch on release.

I dare say that a BWL/AV release would actually cause people to roll over to Kronos from wherever they are. MC is boring. It's by far some of the worst gear Blizzard has ever designed and by far some of the easiest encounters designed simply to acclimate people with the 40m environment.

They are sitting on their laurels over there and people are wondering if they ever intended to follow the time-line at all, this would be a really good time to be the first to give a real, serious estimate on when we can expect to see BWL release, it would drive serious hype and competitive, which benefits even the players who remain there.

There is really nothing but a positive list of reasons why giving us a date on BWL/AV would be an excellent thing for Kronos.

Before people come at me with "more people need to be 60! more people have to clear MC!".

No.

There's several horde guilds who have cleared Rag/Ony and more that have cleared up to Rag, and a handful of guilds on alliance have cleared all or close to all of the content as well. If you didn't make it, you didn't make it at this point. This tier is easy, it's not meant to be dragged out so that everyone gets a swing. There was only a short window of time during actual, retail vanilla where when you began playing, MC was the only future prospective raiding instance awaiting you. Most people had BWL to look forward to when they began, as that's when the game began picking up serious steam.

The worst thing that you can do right now is glaze the drive of your current 60 population. If you bore the heck out of your current 60 population, they will turn away from the game. Right now the focus should be on cultivating your current population of high level characters. Driving content releases to match their speed, and this in turn will create new players in droves due to the prospect of there being so much available content for them should they dedicate themselves to rolling anew on Kronos. ZG and AV would seriously be sprinkles and a cherry on top, but BWL I think is really what can drive this.

Give us a date, or at least an estimate. We only stand to benefit in many ways.

The original Timelime from release to BWL was 8months so if we all want blizzlike it should be released after 5-6 months from now.

Also Nostril dont even have Dire Maul because there devs cant code for shit so i doubt they will have BWL for the next 3 years lol.

 

[Zipzo]

The original Timelime from release to BWL was 8months so if we all want blizzlike it should be released after 5-6 months from now.

Also Nostril dont even have Dire Maul because there devs cant code for shit so i doubt they will have BWL for the next 3 years lol.

I'm pretty sure that in respect to the time-line, not many of us are very concerned about the time windows being "blizz-like".

I'd like to think a great majority of us are simply concerned about their release schedule fitting Kronos specifically.

The players of this realm are not blizz-like. We possess knowledge that was otherwise impossible back then. Strategies. Connections. Therefore it stands to reason that attempting to be "blizz-like" in every respect is actually an effort in futility. In the case of the release dates, this should be tailored to the players and their activity/progression, not to some arbitrary time-line blizzard made for themselves back then when people utterly stunk at raiding in general. It's trying to put a square block in a circular hole.

BWL is essentially t1. It is not even essential that a raid be decked out in MC epics to complete it.

There's no reason to let the MC tier drag out without knowing when we can expect BWL (and ZG to an extent).

 

[Liqorice]

I'm pretty sure that in respect to the time-line, not many of us are very concerned about the time windows being "blizz-like".

I'd like to think a great majority of us are simply concerned about their release schedule fitting Kronos specifically.

The players of this realm are not blizz-like. We possess knowledge that was otherwise impossible back then. Strategies. Connections. Therefore it stands to reason that attempting to be "blizz-like" in every respect is actually an effort in futility. In the case of the release dates, this should be tailored to the players and their activity/progression, not to some arbitrary time-line blizzard made for themselves back then when people utterly stunk at raiding in general. It's trying to put a square block in a circular hole.

BWL is essentially t1. It is not even essential that a raid be decked out in MC epics to complete it.

There's no reason to let the MC tier drag out without knowing when we can expect BWL (and ZG to an extent).

You know most of the population arent yet 60? avarage non fast-leveling players wont hit 60 until 3months after release and if ppl are even slower 4-6months.

The majority of the server has not hit lvl 60 yet so pushing BWL already when like 80% of the server arent even on 60 is dumb as hell.

What can i say, its a blizzlike server and i dont want Naxx to get released in November already lol.
You are only thinking about yourself and your guild and not the majority of the server.

 

[Zipzo]

You know most of the population arent yet 60? avarage non fast-leveling players wont hit 60 until 3months after release and if ppl are even slower 4-6months.

The majority of the server has not hit lvl 60 yet so pushing BWL already when like 80% of the server arent even on 60 is dumb as hell.

What can i say, its a blizzlike server and i dont want Naxx to get released in November already lol.
You are only thinking about yourself and your guild and not the majority of the server.

Most of the population will have stopped playing on Kronos and moved to greener pastures before they hit 60 if content is not properly planned or the time-line doesn't become more "transparent". I know several who quit along the way because they aren't even positive there's a guild available that would fit them. EU is supposed to be the "prime" target region in terms of activity, and they have a grand total of two guilds that have cleared all current content. I don't even need to touch on the NA situation, it should be common knowledge.

People are not following through on their characters. They are quitting, and I'm proposing a pretty decent theory as to why, lack of prospective content security. The excitement of getting in to simply Molten Core is, to be light, a very temporary investment/distraction. It doesn't create the hype we need like a BWL date would.

That "majority" of people you're speaking about that isn't 60 yet? I'd like to see them. I'm on the server almost every day, and I do not play on NA times except for raiding, I live in Japan, and do not see this imaginary giant wave of incoming "casual" 60s some people like to use as their argument stick.

In fact I've yet to even see any wave of 60s past the first big initial one, just a few speckled late comers here and there.

There might be a lot more at play here than the subject of BWL, and this extends in to other issues such as more promotion of Kronos over its opposition and ways in which we can attempt to improve population, but you can't hide or keep secret the issues that Kronos has from a lvl 60 player who's spent a good deal of time at that level.

As I stated earlier, you're for some reason making a correlation between content release and player experience ratio. Who says that a certain % of players have to see Molten Core before we get to move on from it? It's just Molten Core. It could be argued that those who are so casual they've yet to hit 60, are unlikely to raid past Molten Core in any serious form anyway, and if they did, the speed at which it released is not of concern, so why would they be worried or bothered by us getting a date?

 

[Lharts]

7 months from release to BWL

 

[Zipzo]

7 months from release to BWL

Source?

 

[Liqorice]

Most of the population will have stopped playing on Kronos and moved to greener pastures before they hit 60 if content is not properly planned or the time-line doesn't become more "transparent". I know several who quit along the way because they aren't even positive there's a guild available that would fit them. EU is supposed to be the "prime" target region in terms of activity, and they have a grand total of two guilds that have cleared all current content. I don't even need to touch on the NA situation, it should be common knowledge.

People are not following through on their characters. They are quitting, and I'm proposing a pretty decent theory as to why, lack of prospective content security. The excitement of getting in to simply Molten Core is, to be light, a very temporary investment/distraction. It doesn't create the hype we need like a BWL date would.

That "majority" of people you're speaking about that isn't 60 yet? I'd like to see them. I'm on the server almost every day, and I do not play on NA times except for raiding, I live in Japan, and do not see this imaginary giant wave of incoming "casual" 60s some people like to use as their argument stick.

In fact I've yet to even see any wave of 60s past the first big initial one, just a few speckled late comers here and there.

There might be a lot more at play here than the subject of BWL, and this extends in to other issues such as more promotion of Kronos over its opposition and ways in which we can attempt to improve population, but you can't hide or keep secret the issues that Kronos has from a lvl 60 player who's spent a good deal of time at that level.

As I stated earlier, you're for some reason making a correlation between content release and player experience ratio. Who says that a certain % of players have to see Molten Core before we get to move on from it? It's just Molten Core. It could be argued that those who are so casual they've yet to hit 60, are unlikely to raid past Molten Core in any serious form anyway, and if they did, the speed at which it released is not of concern, so why would they be worried or bothered by us getting a date?

This post are totaly fail, im running census 24/7 on both sides.
I know you want new content when you finish the old ones but it will never happend because the server will be over in 1 year then.


Source: WoW Release with MC November 23, 2004
Release of BWL Patch 1.6.0 (12-Jul-2005): Added

 

[joyman]

The chant repeats itself - the endless moaning about new content. Hardcore players are not the majority, but the minority. Patience young grasshopper - there is life outside the game aswell.

 

[Zipzo]

This post are totaly fail, im running census 24/7 on both sides.
I know you want new content when you finish the old ones but it will never happend because the server will be over in 1 year then.


Source: WoW Release with MC November 23, 2004
Release of BWL Patch 1.6.0 (12-Jul-2005): Added

Again, repeating myself, but the list of reasons why how Blizzard did it over 10 years ago, and how it should be done for Kronos are worlds apart. If you can't seem to conclude that in that large of a time window that times have changed then your lack of insight is so great it's hard for me to pinpoint where to begin with you.

I like how you talked about running a census as if wielding it for a weapon, yet provided no further information. Why? Because it's disappointing. Brazen little bluff you have there.

The chant repeats itself - the endless moaning about new content. Hardcore players are not the majority, but the minority. Patience young grasshopper - there is life outside the game aswell.

Lmao, hardcore? That's real funny. That part where you basically and foolishly made gigantic assumptions about my life and how I play. You don't win hearts and minds nor impress anyone by being that ignorant out loud.

 

[Revo]

if MC was more challenging and guilds would've struggled more, much less ppl would cry for bwl now.

its 1 big mistake pretty much all private servers make. they want to simulate vanilla wow, but bring everything in straight from 1.12.1 so especially the first raid dungeons are totally disappointing. so players leave because they lose interest or start crying for new (more challenging) content.

 

[Tugel]

And if you'd change it people would cry that it's not blizzlike. You can't please everyone

 

[Popse]

And where people will leave if they will release MC after like 7 months? Most of us are playing this game 10 years , and are not going to leave soon , unless something happens in Real life , it doesnt matter 3 months or 9 months until BWL anyways people will stay here , because this is most advanced private server ever , here is no alternative , but Release of BWL after 3 months=waste of Chero talent (so many years scripting), because server will end really fast. I would say best would be , stable 6 months before each content . So server would last atleast 2 year with new content , and Devs would have enough time to live their life and script game perfectly

 

[Zipzo]

And where people will leave if they will release MC after like 7 months? Most of us are playing this game 10 years , and are not going to leave soon , unless something happens in Real life , it doesnt matter 3 months or 9 months until BWL anyways people will stay here , because this is most advanced private server ever , here is no alternative , but Release of BWL after 3 months=waste of Chero talent (so many years scripting), because server will end really fast. I would say best would be , stable 6 months before each content . So server would last atleast 2 year with new content , and Devs would have enough time to live their life and script game perfectly

Are you another person that seems to be confusing what I'm asking for?

I'm not asking for it to be released tomorrow, I'm asking for a date, or even an estimation. The point I made was that people need something to look forward to.

Chero has never claimed he is following the 10 years ago Blozzard release time frames to the day or month, and there are many features of Kronos that aren't Blizz-like (beginning to hate this word). I would just like it if this particular date could be clarified because the moment the server goes over the old time-line and we still don't know when BWL is coming...people will be bored by then.

 

[Tripic]

Chero has never claimed he is following the 10 years ago Blozzard release time frames to the day or month, and there are many features of Kronos that aren't Blizz-like (beginning to hate this word).

A good example of how things are done on Kronos is the rules for the Server. The rules aren't exactly Blizzlike but they're an arguable improvement on them. Most of the changes on the server are small enough to keep the experience Blizzlike but have a large positive effect at the same time.

The reason Blizzard released BWL 8 months after MC came out was because the majority of the raiding population took months to down Rag, they needed the time. Now it takes maybe a month to down Rag with a guild that has 30 members in its raid, there is no point in waiting that long to release new content. It is my opinion that if blizzard were to determine how long they should wait before releasing new content now they would wait no longer than 3 months from this point and releasing in that amount of time goes along perfectly with the Kronos Dev team's apparent philosophy. 6-8 guilds have already downed Rag, this is plenty and the 3 month timer should start (if it hasn't started already).

 

[joyman]

Yeah, you are right, leveling in 3 weeks to 60 is completely casual. By my faulty math its 8 hours per day playing the game. I am sorry - when I last played vanilla in 2006 this was considered hardcore.

 

[criscodiscoice]

Yeah I have to work for a living and have priorities IRL does that mean you should pander to me and release stuff later? No! So stop doing that for yourselves I know you feel like you deserve it because you demolished MC and everything in a heartbeat but this game doesn't revolve around you. Compromise with a set date that isn't too far out and not too soon so everyone can win. Don't care what you think is better for the game and what Blizzard should have done just relax and it will be released.

 

[Zipzo]

Yeah I have to work for a living and have priorities IRL does that mean you should pander to me and release stuff later? No! So stop doing that for yourselves I know you feel like you deserve it because you demolished MC and everything in a heartbeat but this game doesn't revolve around you. Compromise with a set date that isn't too far out and not too soon so everyone can win. Don't care what you think is better for the game and what Blizzard should have done just relax and it will be released.

Here's a shocker. I work and even have a family to take care of. Wow! I must be superman or just neglect my family while I'm playing 8 hours a day!

Or maybe it's because I've done this so many times before and it's like clock-work...And I choose my activities efficiently...

The release schedule shouldn't be catered towards the hardest of the core but inversely it also shouldn't be catered to the lowest common denominator.

This isn't about what Blizzard should have done, it's about what Kronos should do. If you think they should release content at the same pace as retail when in actual practice the first tier of content was cleared several times as quickly as it was back then when people were clueless, you're off your head mate.

Even if if this topic was about releasing BWL ASAP, do you suddenly lose the ability to run MC as a result? Do you not remember that back in the day, guilds played to the tier that their raid was prepared for? Even once Naxx releases you had your MC guilds, your BWL/AQ40 guilds, and Naxx pioneers. People picked the content that fit them best.

You're running on a WOTLK and onward mindset that says the old tier is shit tier, or that for some reason if BWL is out, MC becomes obsolete. It doesn't work that way in vanilla, you are mistaken.

Saying that people have yet to clear MC isn't an excuse for BWL not to come out.

 

[Hamtaro]

I really don't understand why everyone is getting upset about you asking for a release date. Especially since you're right! If they take too long, people will quit. This has been proven over and over with the deaths of countless other servers. If they release BWL before Nostalrius does, more people will join this server. Especially if everything is working as intended. So it's only reasonable to ask for this.

Regarding this whole "but most people haven't even cleared MC yet":
There are 7 guilds on this server who have killed all 10 bosses in MC and 2 more who are 1 or maybe 2 weeks away from clearing it as well. Let's say there's 50 active players on average in each guild, this will make 450 total players who have cleared (or are pretty close to clearing) MC. Now while I don't have any exact numbers, I'd estimate the server has a very generous 1500 active(*) players. This means that almost a third of the entire server has cleared the current content! Albeit it's not "the majority", it is still a pretty big chunk and the staff really needs to start thinking on how and when they'll come out with more content. And telling us their plans for the future has no downsides to it, as long as their estimations are reasonable and keep us updated if they weren't.
Source: http://forum.twinstar.cz/showthread.php/92265-Raid-progression-thread



(*) my definition of active: people who log on on a day to day basis and spend at least 4 hours playing. These are the players that are most important to the server

 

[Revo]

a simple statement from a dev/GM would be great tho.
just so ppl dont get the impression you dont care.

 

[Chero]

Hey guys,

It might be time for Blackwing Lair.. However, barely two months passed since launch, and the only reason that's holding us back is the fact, that Kronos is not even two months old.

At such pace, we would have to release Naxxramas this year :>

Blackwing Lair is well prepared and it will be announced before actual release.

 

[alena]

thank you chero, now how about Alterac Valley?

 

[Asmodeus]

thank you chero, now how about Alterac Valley?

all the wants and gimmies!

 

[Zipzo]

Hey guys,

It might be time for Blackwing Lair.. However, barely two months passed since launch, and the only reason that's holding us back is the fact, that Kronos is not even two months old.

At such pace, we would have to release Naxxramas this year :>

Blackwing Lair is well prepared and it will be announced before actual release.

So this tells me something.

You're not catering to the pace of the content, but the intended life of the server?

I think this specific pace only applies to t1 content. Molten Core is simply too easy and it always has been. I seriously doubt the content pace will be as quick with BWL and AQ40.

In any case, thanks for letting us know that BWL is at least prepared, it's just the teams reservation on the release date that is holding a date. I appreciate the word on it.