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    TwinStar team

Other what class counters rouges

Feral, Shp, Mage and Lock are fine. None of them counter really, but they are fine
 
As rogue I'd say
- deep frost mage
- shadow priest
- hunter
- some fat sl who's ilvl bigger than rogue. If rogue same geared - not that hard.

rest are easily counterable by rogue imo, just matter of practice
 
in bgs, a shaman breaks games if alliance have rogues.

Crip Poison rank 2 is one of the best snares (70% movement reduction) in the game, thus it overwrites any other snare like Hamstring (50% i think), something that only a Paladin can remove.

When the shaman puts down a poison cleansing totem, in a few seconds it is removing the debuff that already removed lesser debuffs.

To avoid your snare being removed automatically, alliance rogues either have to apply a different poison, or lose any combo points you had and auto attack the totem.

So as long as that totem is up, every few seconds the EFC is cleared of all snares, not just poisons.

People may not think its a big factor, but in reality its huge.
 
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Vanishing coil melee range is a myth, reactively its only done with sidesteps between attacks to get some distance. If youre not obvious, like suddenly face him with a jump its impossible, just stand on top of him. Id be more worried about reflectors
 
SeeQ said:
Vanishing coil melee range is a myth, reactively its only done with sidesteps between attacks to get some distance. If youre not obvious, like suddenly face him with a jump its impossible, just stand on top of him. Id be more worried about reflectors
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It's possible, but not in the way it acts in TBC. With a low latency you can vanish almost anything, but its due to server lag, not the split second immunity vanish grants in later expansions. On the flipside, your vanish can be ruined by almost anything also, I.E. Auto attacks or even a hunter's mark 100yds away can be connected and pull you out

Basically, if you're not playing with an EU latency don't even try to predict spells.
 
its some weird shit with vanishing stuff tbh. Mixing today big server latency and latency was implemented before it, I got something weird yday - vanished after stunlocking, and still got coil in my face, which ofc was evaded, but it started to land when I was already in stealth lol.
 
I think pretty much every class counters rogue and melee on this server.I will share my issues and problems with it that came long time before some people here got to blame the delay and lag on N0stalrius newcomers.

Ok so i came to this server during 7x event,my ping is twice as big as i had on any private server or online game i played before,and im from Eastern Europe,server is located in Sweden,which gives me 60-80 ping average.I heard server got relocated to Swe so americans can have less ping,well thanks a lot...but for some of eastern europeans its too laggy right now for pvp.I think there is some additional delay,its not only the ping shown- 60-80,may be loss of packages or something,i bet people will say they dont have lag,but of course..Nustalrius never lagged also according to fanboys and it was paradise.

Everytime i try to vanish something,i waste my vanish and get dropped out of stealth short after.Coil,frostbolt,auto attack by hunter,i even randomly vanished and got charged out of stealth from warrior that came out of nowhere behind me and he wasnt even the reason i vanished.Pvp wise there is something very wrong with the script here,i bet you will blame it on my ping,well yes i dont have 0-5 ms as swedish players,but does it mean that 60 ping is a lot and game should be unplayable as it is for me ?

I got that very bad pvp experience way before lag from new people came and when serv had 500-1000 max people overall,even at night ,tried pvping on different timezones to avoid rush hours when obviously server was lagging even more and couldnt handle even 1500-2000 people online during 7x event.

Take it as hate post or whatever,i came from Feenix Warsong 12x,i stopped leveling on Nustalrius at level 21 year ago due to unplayable lag,its not much better here for pvp,as MELEE especially.It feels like script pvp wise is also benefiting heavily casters,reflectors are screwed also.Now i realize feenix wasnt 100 % blizzlike,but no server is perfect,at least it had 20-30 ping instead triple that and i could react and avoid some things in pvp.

I also played vanilla during retail 2004-2006 and never had issues like this before,or at least i dont recall it,after all it was 12 years ago.Inside Warsong gulch,people can shoot below the gy while ur on top with ranged abilities and hit you up there while out of line of sight,also trying to get out of line of sight while mage is casting sheep and he will always sheep me behind a building or a tree.Also restealthing during a caster and that caster will drop me out of stealth 1-2 sec later,its not lag...its failed script or whatever you call it,60-80 ping cannot cause such thing.It is frustrating to pvp here.

Apologizing in advance if some of the things i mentioned are blizzlike but as i said already it was long time ago and last memories i had were from feenix from 1-2+ years ago and it wasnt 100 % accurate server,so thats why.
 
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You have to pop reflector before the projectile is flying to you,so if you count lag...and have to predict it,its useless basically.Same as vanish currently,i cant even vanish auto attack from hunter after trap,it insta drops me out.

One last thing on top of my head,its really too many problems and i didnt pvp much even: So after warlock coils me and starts casting fear,i vanish the incoming fear and boom it drops me out of stealth again.Its also impossible to vanish a blind and i tried once against coil to gouge and sprint away as possible and guess what ? I was spamming vanish and it felt like projectile of coil hit me even before it came to me,i was not in control of my character,lag...server delay or whatever,i wish i could try with 0-5 ms as i said to see if its that but im not from Sweden.
 
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Paybackz said:
You have to pop reflector before the projectile is flying to you,so if you count lag...and have to predict it,its useless basically.Same as vanish currently,i cant even vanish auto attack from hunter after trap,it insta drops me out.

One last thing on top of my head,its really too many problems and i didnt pvp much even: So after warlock coils me and starts casting fear,i vanish the incoming fear and boom it drops me out of stealth again.Its also impossible to vanish a blind and i tried once against coil to gouge and sprint away as possible and guess what ? I was spamming vanish and it felt like projectile of coil hit me even before it came to me,i was not in control of my character,lag...server delay or whatever,i wish i could try with 0-5 ms as i said to see if its that but im not from Sweden.
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Youre not doing it right then. As far as I know, rogues can vanish death coils.

@Kuro, go duel Rhythmic if you think warlock stands even a small chance against rogues.
 
Cr0wL0ck said:
I would say Affliction Warlocks or Hunters are the best Rogue counter in 1.12.1
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[video=youtube;NENsoOaM7xc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NENsoOaM7xc[/video]
affli wlocks pretty ez to rape tho. sucess vs em is a count of
- good open (50%)
- distance control (30%)
- countering coil via vanish/reflector (30%).
Warlock is one of two classes, who havent any stun counter (trinket/spell) exc racial (orc) or consumables use (living action potion/free action potion). Second class is rogue, thats the reason of my race choice :^).
So, usually what rogues doing with warlocks duel-wise this content, is able to see on vidrelated, 6:45, 2:29. Thats why at RvW duels warlocks prefer spec SL to win as much survivality as it possible, even sacrificing lot of damage and distance bonuses (how they matter if u getting fukt in a stunlock).

Hunter duel is matter of
- good open (if some silly hunter will not just stay at flare all the time at duel). 50%
- having skull/frost reflector/creatures summon things to counter FD/Trap. 40%
- have good reaction for trinket use. 10%
Typical example of rogue vs hunter duel is at vidrelated 7:00
Keeping distance is much important tho. But if you have skull and reflector ready, its just melee fight. Counter stronk two hander blows and pet attacks via evasion, control dodge angle and its oke.

Worth to mention tho that its all just dueling-wise comments, if one of them starts to attack rogue from range, pretty sure yeh hes fukt
 
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Oooor instead of a couple pages of tactics for each class, you do the fgt move with no counterplay I used to make. Gouge, death ray into cold blood evis. 3k burst minimum even on plate. #Outplayed
 
SeeQ said:
Oooor instead of a couple pages of tactics for each class, you do the fgt move with no counterplay I used to make. Gouge, death ray into cold blood evis. 3k burst minimum even on plate. #Outplayed
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There are multiple counterplays for gouge? Sure, if the rogue overlaps the gouge with a stun it's harder to react to, but even then you can simply anticipate it if you follow the opponents movement, especially if you're able to check the trinkets the rogue is wearing beforehand and you know he's been going for the move before. A bunch of rogues I've fought seem to prefer trying for another opener rather than using a death ray/evis, though.
 
I cant think of many, block, bubble and berserk rage. Wasting it on a stun is ineficient, you could be attacking instead, gouge however is perfect for this. If not gouge then with a sap or blind, during stuns its not worth
 
I don't think you completely understood what I'm trying to say.

On a server like Kronos with working delay, instant stun/cc and certain dodge-increasing abilities can be used to counter the gouge. It's usually one of the easier rogue abilities to anticipate as it requires the rogue to face you, so even if the rogue gouges you close to the end of a kidney/cheap/tidal it's possible to react to, assuming you happen to be carrying something to remove a stun with (lap/trinket).

You can also just skull the gouge or use one of the abilities you mentioned.
 
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