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    TwinStar team

fix AV, save K2

Revo

Revo

Authorized
Joined
Mar 14, 2015
i think the recent custom changes applied to AV were not successful in any way. They just broke av and fixed nothing at all. That's why I would like to use this thread to propose proper Solutions for av that make it play- and enjoyable, yet not op, so it's "hopefully" being played like back then. Like "it's meant to".

Main issue was rushing the honor-objectives, mainly leaded by premades, even though av was never meant to be played premade.

Solutions
First: add a randomized Timer for AV queing.
If one signs up for av, he is not instantly put i to the Queue. It's delayed for like 0-60 (random) seconds. The player does not see this Delay. This way, joining av as premade is quite impossible.

Second: take the good stuff from old AV.
investigate what has been different in AVs Pre and post Nerf. Take whatever might help to fix av from the Pre nerfed av and implementiert it into ours (e.g. stronger NPCs).

Optionals, custom changes
Since the main issue is rushing the honor-objectives:

Possibility 1: reward defending honor-objectives.
Example: every Lieutenant has his equivalent on the Opposing faction, so has a "related" Lieutenant. if he dies, the Honor your faction is rewarded with for killing their related lieutenant is being reduced (e.g. halfed). so people will think about defending their stuff as well.

Possibility 2: reward superiority, punish inferiority (losing on purpose). (rather complex, so rather unlikely to happen)
Example: add arathi basin like mechanics to AV-honor-rewards.
The more important areas your faction controls (graveyards etc), the more Honor you gain per minute. However, the gain decays over time relative to the time it has been captured the first time by your faction, so "endless av" is not being rewarded, but map-control is. Moreover, every objective has a weigth. So objectives next to the enemy Base Grant more Honor than those next to yours.

possibility 3: combination of 1 and 2,
Example: like in 1, the honor you get for completing an objective like killing a lieutenannt is being reduced, as soon as you lose your equivalent. however, the reduction is now being calculated on how long youve managed to keep /defend your own objective compared to the enemy faction. so defending your objectives will reward you, losing objectives very soon will punish you.


these are just ideas that came to my mind. a few are rather complex so rather unlikely to happen. however, what are you thoughts for AV to get it "back on track"? the goal should be that AV is played "properly" again, like back then (most of the time).

(wrote on mobile)
 
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Surely you realise that AV is the worst designed pile of shit in WoW history and no minute nitpicking is going to change that?
 
The situation with AV made it where anyone with a pulse could sit at their PC solo queueing for XX hours per day and take standing 1. It was also not even possible to play WSG or AB except on bonus weekends.

Now, the situation is back to how Vanilla is designed to be. The teams that are the most organized/tryhard and run with the best gear/class comp possible take the top standings. There is still at least 1 AV game open 24/7, and on AV weekends, casuals can get their dose of insane solo queue Honor.

The 2nd situation (how it is now) is simply how Vanilla is designed. It rewards players that play in tryhard groups. Plain and simple.

AV is also an afterthought in terms of grinding ranks (which again, is how Vanilla is designed). There is still at least one AV game open 24/7, and it is populated with casual players and PvE players farming rep. There is not a Premade to be found in AV. Achieving high ranks requires playing WSG/AB with an organized/tryhard group. WSG and AB don't feature NPC's and require actual use of PvP mechanics to win.

Again, simply how things are supposed to be. There's not argument or discussion to be had. This is how Vanilla PvP is designed.

Dodging is clearly a problem, just as it has been on every other Vanilla server since the dawn of time. However, the Premades that dodge will always get out-farmed by a superior Premade that doesn't need to dodge and crushes all their opponents. Dodging sucks, but it's the "lesser of the evils" if you will when it comes to flaws in the Vanilla PvP system. Having dodgers on the server is much, much better than having wintraders or having Chinese industry take over the server because solo queue r14 is possible.

If deserter for dropping queue were added, the PvP scene would instantly become more competitive. Because taking top standings would actually require being able to defeat enemy premades consistently and efficiently.
 
TheOG said:
The situation with AV made it where anyone with a pulse could sit at their PC solo queueing for XX hours per day and take standing 1.
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yes, anyone. and then theres that 1 guy that makes 1 HK and suddenly "anyone" isnt #1 anymore. no matter how easy you get honor, standings and thus high pvp ranks are always determined relative to others, thus they are determined by the efforts others are willing to put in. table tennis might be easy to play, yet youll never get a top standing. your statement is another poop on the massive pile of sht youve already put in this forum.
btw, its pretty much the same thats being done in WSG now. additionally, everyone knows that AV was broken, thats why proper solutions are neccessery and i requested to propose them here. the changes that were recently made just broke it, nothing else. and now we're playing a broken WSG. and your "thats how its meant to be" means nothing but "thats how i like it".

your posts are always so full of biased bullsht, cant even read it any further
 
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Revo said:
and your "thats how its meant to be" means nothing but "thats how i like it."
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No, it means that's how it's been on every Blizzlike Vanilla private server for 5+ years, LOL

Again, this isn't my opinion or my perception. It's just Vanilla.
 
untergang said:
This isn't true. AV hasn't popped for 18 hours as of my posting this.
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avpop.jpg

Are you playing K2? I have been getting AV pops since i got home from work (same timezone as server). It is now 21:26 and AV still popping.
 
I'm on K2 and its been 24 hours since I've seen an AV pop. I've been checking regularly during peak EU and NA hours. I work a schedule where I sleep early NA mornings and wake up late morning, which is peak EU time. Now we're coming on peak NA time and still nothing.
 
You guys do realise that having the queue pop is strictly a community thing as well. If there were 20 people on each side that wanted to play fun AV for pvp etc, the queue would pop even without the added incentive of getting easy honor as it was.

Why do you think it doesn't pop?
 
snawfu said:
You guys do realise that having the queue pop is strictly a community thing as well. If there were 20 people on each side that wanted to play fun AV for pvp etc, the queue would pop even without the added incentive of getting easy honor as it was.

Why do you think it doesn't pop?
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quite interesting since there is 1 AV and 0 WSG for the past hours
 
Revo said:
quite interesting since there is 1 AV and 0 WSG for the past hours
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Because it's AV weekend and the free Honor is back

How clueless can u be? lol

Changes are great and PvP is much more healthy than it was before.
 
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TheOG said:
Because it's AV weekend and the free Honor is back

How clueless can u be? lol

Changes are great and PvP is much more healthy than it was before.
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Sorry m8, but how can you say that PvP is much more healthy if you never pvped ?
There's a huge difference between PvP and honor grinding, they're not the same thing

You never played outside of your "bubble" even now that you got R14 and the only that you have left is pure PvP, but you keep playing in your group. You probably know that, but there's no R15 dude you already can stop the honor grinding.
 
The only people who wants to play AV, and wants AV back are the people who wants gear in the easiest way possible. Sitting AFK for X hours is way easier than having to form a premade and try to dominate in AB or WSG. Now that AV has been nerfed, people cant get free ranking, and they dont bother. People did not que AV because it was good or fun, they queued it because it was a free ticket to ranks.
 
pff
Are you talking about when horde is playing against a premade and they all go afk, not cuz it's easy honor but cuz they can't do shit about it like in EVERY SINGLE WARSONG AND AB ASWELL ?

It happens on alliance side too but i guess only against premades, on pugs i only see 3-5 max afk in AV.
 
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Maybe we should accept dodging and wintrading and get back multi queue.
Feel like multi-queue is better.
 
AsCE said:
Enable multi queue for solo queue so that premades cant dodge but pugs can.
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Why not separate queues then ?

Who want to tryhard will get tryhard groups, who want pugs will get pugs.
Sounds more then fair to me.

"Tryhard players" aka pug stompers will get mad cuz there will be no free honor anymore

It could encourage casuals/pvers to queue and have fun
 
dkramer said:
Sorry m8, but how can you say that PvP is much more healthy if you never pvped ?
There's a huge difference between PvP and honor grinding, they're not the same thing

You never played outside of your "bubble" even now that you got R14 and the only that you have left is pure PvP, but you keep playing in your group. You probably know that, but there's no R15 dude you already can stop the honor grinding.
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Nice baseless personal attacks. I've played loads of solo queue since the AV fix. I've also joined a couple thrown-together premades to FC and help them out, which resulted in some fun/close/competitive games. That's how I know PvP is healthy again.

I specifically haven't played w/ the Alliance ranker group a single time since the fixes.

Its funny how all the anonymous forum posters that are whining about the AV fixes always end up revealing that they're just salty towards players that know how Vanilla works and have a fucking clue to join a Premade.
 
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TheOG said:
Its funny how all the anonymous forum posters that are whining about the AV fixes always end up revealing that they're just salty towards players that know how Vanilla works and have a fucking clue to join a Premade.
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What's even more funny is that you refuse to admit that pugs getting farmed by premades or dodgemades is not PvP. All you do is keep repeating the same rubbish of "vanilla PvP is about forming premades, if you "don't have a fucking clue to join a premade", go play somewhere else".

How about for once in your life you try understanding where other people come from? That not everybody is here crying because we suck at the game and we want to be boosted by "pro's". But instead, we want battlegrounds to be about PvP, and not about being cannon fodder to those, who according to you, "have a fucking clue how Vanilla works", and who, at the same time, seem to want less PvP than we do.

Just as you wanted AV farming to stop because it wasn't PvP, we want WSG/AB to change because it's not PvP. But here you are, telling us to "get a fucking clue" even though we seemingly want the same thing as you do. PvP.
 
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