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[BWL] Blackwing Lair Scripting: Final Verdict?

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May 22, 2015
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#2
  • In the supression room, traps kept going up and whelps kept respawning during the fight with Broodlord Lashlayer
  • While pulling trash packs on the upper level behind Firemaw, blackwing warlocks twice went to the other group and pulled it with them towards us (no, we didn't pull them too close to the other group, we pulled them far away). We think it's pathing issues due to agro holder jumping on a small ledge next to the wall that made the mobs go crazy and run to the other side and pull half the room. The mobs shouldn't have trouble with pathfinding towards a target that simply moved to a tiny bit higher terrain.
  • Chromaggus debuff applications were so often that our healers/dispellers ran out of sand at 50% of his HP and could just stand helplessly in stunlock while raid members were turning into dragonkin.
 
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HBK

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#4
  • In the supression room, traps kept going up and whelps kept respawning during the fight with Broodlord Lashlayer
since when is that a bug? ofcourse the whelps should respawn every 30seconds. They only shouldn't respawn after Lashlayer is dead. And of course the Traps don't stay down forever. They didn't stay down forever on retail.
Sorry, hit me with a brick but i don't see a bug there

imo, it looks like you got too used to "other private server conveniences"
 

Vahn

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#5
since when is that a bug? ofcourse the whelps should respawn every 30seconds. They only shouldn't respawn after Lashlayer is dead. And of course the Traps don't stay down forever. They didn't stay down forever on retail.
Sorry, hit me with a brick but i don't see a bug there

imo, it looks like you got too used to "other private server conveniences"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDW3nAMRRio

I think you're mistaken :) Since I don't see any whelps respawning nor trap coming back up during encounter of Broodlord.

Also, we encounterred a bug where none of our rogues could get any trap down in suppression room.. Which means we had to brute force through it.. or slow force.. W/e.

Anyhow, adds shouldn't spawn while dealing with broodlord nor should traps come up.

EDIT: not sure why you bashing him for with, "used to other private servers" .. It's not because majority of a guild comes from ED you should bash em for reporting bugs.. Which are bugs :)
 

HBK

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#6
well, ok i checked a few videos myself now and i apologize, the whelps really don't seem to respawn during the Lashlayer fight.

However in this video here, you can see that the device DOES come back up after some time. i don't know how fast it comes back up on Kronos, but they are supposed to at some point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=km4_W5-T8sk the device is coming back up @ 3:32 and AGAIN at 3:50
 
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Lharts

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#7
"other private server conveniences"
You mean like working pets?

Scripting is top notch. Period.
I see what you are trying to imply and can safely say that bosses aren't easy. The only reason guilds can take them down in the first ID is simple. BWL release was too late. Guilds already equipped themselves thoroughly.
 

maredasan

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#8
Overall I think it was a pleasant surprise. Apart from the things listed already, the only other "weird" things that happened to us was Flamegor giving us a visit in Vael room (wiping us ^_^), and the large dragonkin packs directly after Vael resetting several times in combat.
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2015
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#9
  • Chromaggus debuff applications were so often that our healers/dispellers ran out of sand at 50% of his HP and could just stand helplessly in stunlock while raid members were turning into dragonkin.
Allthough I don't necessarily disagree, I think we should compare a Twitch VODs towards what we have available on YouTube etc. when it comes to debuffs. From what I can see (on vids from retail) it seems that Chromaggus throws out two of the potential four magic/poison/disease/curse every 15 seconds, and it ranges from 8-12 applications of each type.

What's more concerning is that keyboardturning scrubs without a single consumable eating time-lapse on 20+ people managed to kill him on some vids, while we were so oom it hurts after 50% with every consumable imagineable.
 
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#10
Ok,

I have an example regarding the debuffs:

This VOD is from one our shammies last night, the Chromaggus attempts are 3:06:00 in to the video:
http://www.twitch.tv/xhault/v/12917143

This video is from a random guy from Turalyon EU. He's a druid and his raidframes only shows curses and poisons, but notice how there is even a stretch of almost a minute without a curse and/or poison being applied:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c01N1_tlw04

Forgive me if the above is from a random private server.

Anyway, if we are to to believe that the second video is legit retail, the debuff application interval is every 15 seconds, and it seems only two types are applied, meaning you can get "lucky stretches" (for horde, magic dispel problems) and get 30 or 45 second intervals without much job.

Back to Kronos, the debuff application interval is every 10 seconds, and you get in the region of 30-33 debuffs of ALL types EVERY time.

I realize the video from retail I posted isn't the best, so hopefully someone can dig up a healer with a better UI to track all debuffs.

Anyway, if the above holds true it's very impressive to foresee a double overtuning of a boss.
 

Lharts

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#12
Also, someone in worldchat mentioned that is was possible to avoid the bronze stun with limited invulnerability potions. If this is the case then please remove it and only reapply if definite proof is available. It could potentially break the whole purpose of the affliction.
If the stun could be avoided this easily having Free Action Potions for Chromaggus would be in every guide, or?

Additionally, a guild mate told me that the bronze affliction was applied to the whole raid. After some digging through youtube I found that this is incorrect. Only a few players should get the affliction at a time. Maybe as Rolex says, 8-12, but don't know.
 
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#13
Here's a quick timeline of a stretch:

3:05:33 - 31 debuffs applied. 9 magic, 7 poison, 9 disease, 6 curse.
3:05:43 - 27 debuffs applied. 3 magic, 8 poison, 9 disease, 7 curse.
3:05:53 - At this point some debuffs are already de-syncing with a timer, and there is so overlapping, but a rough estime: 30 debuffs applied. 5 magic, 8 poison, 8 disease, 9 curse.
3:06:04 - 30 debuffs applied. 11 magic, 5 poison, 6 disease, 8 curse.
3:06:14 - 32 debuffs applied. 12 magic, 5 poison, 8 disease, 7 curse.
3:06:24 - 33 debuffs applied. 13 magic, 6 poison, 8 disease, 6 disease.
3:06:35 - By the time this wave hits there's still ~9 magic up, and 35 people have debuffs on them. It's all downhill from here.

Is this for real? Am I missing something here? 183 debuffs in 1 min, not counting the ones which are applied off-sync with the 10 second interval.

Edit:

I have no clue about the Bronze. All I know is that after ~1 minute the entire raid was blanketed in Bronze and was stunned for what I believe was 25-35% of the time. With limited sands you just have to roll with it, and if it's a random 10-12 players per 10 seconds (mind you I also think the 10 second interval is 33% too fast) it's getting sticky rather fast.
 
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#15
Just watched Vanguard's stream, and the mage got what? 5 debuffs the entire fight tonight. Is this suddenly hotfixed? According to our attempts, every 10 seconds any given player had a 60-75% of getting a debuff.

What is going on?
 

Excy

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#16
No, debuffs were, as you said, being put up constantly. We just had a lot of people dispelling all the time.
 

Excy

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#19
this isn't any different on horde, but for us the entire raid had bronze affliction after ~5 seconds or so
We had that aswell, I dont know if it's the whole raid but I got it instantly all the time and a lot of people aswell as soon as Chromaggus was pulled.
 

Vahn

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Feb 21, 2015
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#20
On our kill I used 2x Hourglass Sand and each time RIGHT after I used it I got the bronze again.. So yeah RIP. We had everybody spamming dispells and using them Restorative Potions.. Without the right amount of dispellers this boss is a huge mess.. Also, I believe felhunters can help on locks (if groups don't need the imp buff that is..) On horde this boss is definitely harder to beat and kudos to the guild that does it first.

The amount of stuns is huge and for us the Time Lapse didn't make it any better.. (Since health is not effectively healed back up when Time Laps runs out + amount of debuffs)
 
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#21
We had 8 people spamming /decursive. I'm sure he was just high on cleansing list so they'd get instantly removed.
Hmm, its no VOD of it so can't comment, but having your ninth highest dps on prio is a bit strange? And it was literally stretches of 40 seconds where he went without debuffs.

His grid tracked debuffs with the small dots in the corners so kinda impossible to say much about the rest.

Anyway, if it's the same tuning I don't see horde doing this anytime soon. Dispelling is just too expensive (magic), and there's no "3 in 1" to recover.

Edit: and yeah time-lapse is brutal
 

Vahn

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#22
Hmm, its no VOD of it so can't comment, but having your ninth highest dps on prio is a bit strange? And it was literally stretches of 40 seconds where he went without debuffs.

His grid tracked debuffs with the small dots in the corners so kinda impossible to say much about the rest.

Anyway, if it's the same tuning I don't see horde doing this anytime soon. Dispelling is just too expensive (magic), and there's no "3 in 1" to recover.

Edit: and yeah time-lapse is brutal
Made an issue for something, might interest you.

https://vanilla-twinhead.twinstar.cz/?issue=7079

I hope it will all get fixed soon , so horde can get past him as well..
 

Liqorice

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May 12, 2015
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#23
Synced did it, called in 3 extra palas :)
Finally a hard boss for everyone, people need the right classes thats all :)


I think the only scripting problems Rebirth had to this point was Firemaw bugged down one floor and killed all of us on the second boss and multipack was pulled once.
 
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entyckk

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Aug 10, 2015
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#24
Just watched Vanguard's stream, and the mage got what? 5 debuffs the entire fight tonight. Is this suddenly hotfixed? According to our attempts, every 10 seconds any given player had a 60-75% of getting a debuff.

What is going on?
I can't really comment on the frequency of the debuffs I got, as I was mainly concentrating on my Bronze debuff combined with breath/time lapse timers (I had zero sands), the magic vulnerability of Chromaggus and the threat, but the dispellers were doing a great job and mages helped with the curses when the vulnerability was nature/shadow.
 
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